Butt Talk with Kenny

WEBVTT

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The later it gets, the more
you get weirdo assmen. And on that

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note, Welcome to the Track Wars
podcast, the one podcast on the online

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Internet that dares to answer the question
which is better Star Trek or Star Wars

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by going through both franchises and chronological
release order. I am Kenny Madison,

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the Star Trek contingent, and with
me as my co host, with the

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my host, I'm Aspen Webster.
I am not on the online Internet.

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I am on the intranet offline.
I've set my work to be offline available

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and when I reconnect to the Internet, it will sync. I am in

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support of Star Wars. He sends
to me online Internet, and it was

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so funny to me. Yeah,
that's right. And speaking of reconnections,

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still too, is this episode of
track Wars about reconnections? As we watch

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some at least one iconic episode hadn't
watched the other Ewok episodes before. But

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we're watching Journey to Babel versus Gone
with the Nymphs versus The First Apprentice,

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My dude, my guy, my
brow, my friend, Yessen. What

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a night, What a night,
What a night of television, What a

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night of premiere television. This was
on loves not seen since I don't know

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built my mother the car. No, it's actually a really good ship.

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It was great. This is the
TV we watched some good TV. Did

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you know two of the episode?
You do know this because you're the researcher.

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I like the research the episode.
Oh, we'll talk about this.

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Gone with the Nymphs written by Linda
Wolverton. We'll talk about that. And

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then, of course, uh,
the I got it. I gotta clarify,

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not Gone with the Nymphs, Gone
with the Nymphs, Nymphs, Nymphs,

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radically different episode if it was Gone
with nips, especially children Star Wars

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TV show, Gone with the Wood
Nymphs, naked in the woods, naked,

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Mike turning into trees because they're trying
to get away from Dionysus, Gone

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with the Nymphs, Gone with the
Memphs. My favorite Lily Lily Putiens.

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Uh yeah, written by a woman, Linda Wolverton. And then Journey to

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Babel written by DC Fontana, who
I'm realizing is my girl my girl?

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So interesting. Yeah, otherwise that's
yeah, not that, and we almost

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got we almost got across the boarder. But then that's stupid. Paul Deini

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get out of her pall. I
don't need the p Yeah. Well,

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let's be real. Diversity shouldn't just
include white women. But I am looking

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for anything I can get here,
and I could feel, uh, we'll

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get into this. But I just
have to tell you that I was thrillly

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thrilled to see, not to take
not to take your research away from you,

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that Linda Wolverton was a screenwriter for
Beauty and the Beast and the Lion

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King. WHOA, I didn't know
that, and the reason and I was

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like, who the fuck wrote this? Is because I was watching that episode

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and the second episode also really great, but I was watching it, I

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was like, this is distinctly interesting
and funny. Like it it's funny and

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it's weird and it's dynamic and strange, and I was like, I just

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really enjoyed it. And then I
looked that up and I went oh,

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and then I also loved the other
one. But then I was also watching

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the Journey to Babel and I was
like, why is every moment of this

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interesting? Why is this all about
feelings and parental familial relationships and what do

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we mean to each other? And
I was like, DC, my girl,

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Well, ask when, before we
get too much into the wonderful themes

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that are presented by the writers of
these episodes, why don't we present some

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synopsies for folks that are playing the
home game at home on the online internet.

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Yes, on the online internet.
A yes, oh yes, I'm

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low gray tiny storm that is in
Aspen's room. Wow, this storm.

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That's funny, funny bunny. Okay, I got you, I got you

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first. So of course we're back
to their two whips to make up the

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fall, gone with this two whips, this step reverse, gone with the

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mid slash the first apprentice. Of
course, this is Star Wars ewoks a

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reminder to everyone. I think Star
Wars is better than Star Trek because art

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is a binary and this cartoon is
better than an iconic episode. But I

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was like, that sounds great anyway. Released October eighteenth, nineteen eighty six.

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Like we just said, we got
Linda Wilverson for the first one,

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Pauldine as the Ready for the second
one. I guess both of them are

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directed by Dale Shot. Yes,
so let's see. For the first,

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Chief Chirpa gathers the warriors to defend
against a rampaging Hannah Deck and Wicket gets

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lost. Yeah, I just wanted
to make sure because I only hear it,

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and I was just like, is
that what was said? And I

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wrote Hannah Deck, so I think
that is how it was said. That's

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how I wrote Hannah Deck. In
my own notes, I was like,

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I wrote, why are we hunting
it? What's the point of this?

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Anyway, we'll get into it.
Basically what happens is, yeah, Wicket

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tries to go off and hunt it
himself, and in the process he ends

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up in a river, goes over
a waterfall. My greatest childhood and adult

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fear, ends up with his little
head bonked, and then getting tied up

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by the Memphs and forced to perform. And the MEPs had the funniest voice

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I've ever heard. He's mostly just
annoyed with them. It deeply very Gulliver's

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travels. I'm sure there's some commentary
here on the English system of government if

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you look hard. So fabulous.
His friends think he's dead. It's super

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funny. I loved it. It's
great. Second episode. Sorry, I

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was like, is there more?
There's more? Second episode? Uh?

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The what we say? It was
the first Apprentice and this one after Zaric.

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Oh my God, it starts at
the wrong spot. There's this guy

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Zaric. I'm doing a better description
than IMDb. Zeric was low Gray's first

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apprentice. Uh, but he was
kicked out because he wanted to do bad,

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mischievous magic. Low Gray wouldn't teach
him, and he just seemed like

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a bad guy. Whereas low Gray
said, he was what did he say?

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He said? He said, I
I'm not doing this right, but

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it was just very funny to me. He said, impatience turns you evil,

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basically, So remember that children.
After Zaric tries to teach Tibo his

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dark secrets, Wicked and his friends
come to the rescue, Tebow musters enough

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magic to defeat Zeric. It's true. Sarah looks in his little pool like

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the snow white switch and like may
or Mirror, who will defeat me?

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And they're like dobow and He's like
the fuck anyway. That is such a

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good job. Yeah, probably the
best job that you've ever done. Thank

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you so much. I'm just always
there's never there's never a good medium.

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There's either the two like it's not
descriptive enough on IMDb or it's like an

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entire Wikipedia article. Look, whenever
we get back into more walked territory versus

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star wars he walks. I have
a sneaky suspicion that the synopsies you get

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better. Yeah, okay, thank
you so much. In the meantime,

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uh, I will do the recap
for Journey to Babel, first aired November

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seventeenth, nineteen sixty seven, written
by D. C. Fontana pretty much

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all her own and directed by Joseph
Eviny from Judy Crosby at the Saint Petersburg

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Time in Saint Petersburg, Florida to
Florida. I just wanted to get this

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done. Oh my gosh, sorry
that you have to adjust that laugh cough

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right there. Uh. The fans
of Stern Trek's weird, wise and unworldly

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Doctor Spock are in for a first
rate episode tonight is. The story closely

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examines his unusual breeding and his relationship
with his mother, an earthly and his

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father, a vulcan. Jane Wyatt
makes a rare TV appearance as his mother,

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with Mark Leonard as Ambassador Saric his
father. The story takes place on

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a space journey that is besieged with
emergencies, including a murder. Father is

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accused, which gives the story the
necessary excuse for digging into the unusual Father's

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connection. There's also a very unique
sequence aboard the Enterprise featuring several outer space

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types, which gives the makeup and
costing people a big challenge. Pretty true,

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I would say, who wrote that? From Saint Petersburg, Judy Grosby

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at the Saint Petersburg Time. Judy, you were right. You could have

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read that. Uh November seventeenth,
nineteen sixty seven. Incredible quick Q for

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you qq qq. The guy who
played Sarah did he also play the Romulan

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from Okay okay? Yeah? The
TV great where they are just like we

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like this guy was just give them
another role. It's great. I love

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it. What was it? Was
it murdered? No, I told you

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this already. I was about to
repeat a story I've told you before.

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But it's that on, not murder, she wrote. But Perry Mason that

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they use it as an as an
opportunity to employ a lot of maybe older

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actors who still wanted to work,
but you know, maybe weren't getting as

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much as many jobs as they were, and they'd be like, yeah,

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fuck you, I'll put you in. Yeah. And you know how I

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realized that in this moment. It's
because I was reflecting on the performance that

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he gave, which is deep beat. Dare I say, I feel like

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it has a lot of gravitas,
and I think it's very emotional. Oh,

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which is so funny. I know, how dare I, He's a

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vulcan, but it This is the
great thing about vulcans, right where uh

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an eighth of a smile suddenly has
folks that are watching this episode just pumping

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their fists of being like, what
an explosive emotion. It is a brilliant

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exercise and acting of just never showing
your top, so whenever you finally do

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show your top, it becomes showing
your top, no showing show the top.

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I'm stealing this from showing your shirt. Star Trek two The Wrath of

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Khan, where Ricardo Montalban shows up
on set and he's stuck in Fantasy Island

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acting mode. Nicholas Meyer goes over
and says something along the lines of you

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never want to show your top because
once you go there, the audience knows

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there's nowhere else to go. Oh
oh, And after that, Ricardo Montalban

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goes, oh, great, I'm
going to get directed. How wonderful,

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and then he brought it down pulls
back. So his performance in that movie

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then has a beautiful emotional arc that
will get to he's also a top in

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that film, I would say pretty
much, Yeah, agreed, I yeah,

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but there there is a very similar
sort of oh deep humanity, what's

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the what's the episode again? With
the oh fuck? What is it?

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Balance of terror? Balance of terror? Because in that one, that character

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he's playing, there's a lot it
feels like, just like a lot of

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world weary sadness. Yeah, like
and you do what you have to do

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as part of the system, you're
part of and we're just we're just getting

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by through the universe. And there
is the same sort of feeling in this

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one, despite it being a very
different character in a very different kind of

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situation. I feel like there's a
lot of it feels like sadness, like

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weariness and sadness, and also like
the sweetest little moments of love, which

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is just so funny because the whole
point of it is is just there's a

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I mean, I don't know if
if it's okay to dive into it already,

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but I guess we can make out. We're making our rules at tire

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bagas. Yeah, we're just in
our first impressions. We're talking about stuff

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that we like and stuff Kenny by
following the rules? Am I fathering it?

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Not to again overuse that? But
also this is well the formative episode.

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We meet Spock's mom and dad,
and I will tell you I realized,

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I don't think I've ever seen this
episode before. So it was a

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real mind fuck you because I have
seen strange in New Worlds and so I

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was like, I've seen his mom, and I was like, you haven't

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not ans, you know. And
when they first introduce his dad, his

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father comes, he gets by the
way coolest. They do this really great

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shot where they like push through the
door and then there's just a line of

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officers and then he they gets off
the shuttle. They don't push through the

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door though, they just stay on
the other side of the door. Yeah,

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they don't. They don't push through
it entirely. It's just like the

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door frames them and it's fabulous.
And he starts walking down and the look

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he gave them immediately was like,
is that his dad? Because if I

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there's anyone who knows complicated familiar relations, it is me. And then as

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soon as like he was like,
this is my wife and I saw she

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was human. I was like,
that's his dad, that's his mom and

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dad. Yeah, but it's just
uh, there's a point in the end

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episode where his mom is like this, the fact that they are vulcan is

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the reason they couldn't be father and
son for like all this time. And

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I put this to you, Kenny
that much. I feel like we always

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see this with Spock and we're talking
about it right now, like the smallest

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bits of emotion. The story of
Spock, the reason he's so compelling is

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because he shows us what it is
to be human, and his moments of

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humanity feel so overwhelmingly human that like
overwhelmingly so right, And something about that

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relationship, despite being framed as vulcan, is so human to me. It

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felt so much just like anyone who's
ever been like, yeah, I cannot

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emotionally connect with my father. What
does it mean? He's not proud of

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me. It's just expected of me, you know, or you know,

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I have to serve a purpose and
I must you know, follow him,

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and if I don't, there's disappointment. But I just was like a lie

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allay walk with me on this one
asmen television. No, No, I'm

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just making I'm just making noises.
Yeah, move on. No, I

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didn't say no, I said,
you know, I meant to sing.

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I want to walk with you please. So TV at this time is still

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kind of playing more to the cheap
seats. We have yet to hit the

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Hollywood tendency that will come about in
the late nineteen sixties thanks to movies like

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BII and Clyde Easy Writer, where
we hit upon a more naturalistic rhythm of

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acting, more subtle, more subdued. And so we've got folks like William

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Shanner establishing the archetype of what it
means to be a barrel chested captain,

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a hero, rough and tumble American
man, even though he's Canadian Jew.

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And then he's expressive McCoy, expressive
Southern doctor Spock. There is a canonical

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reason, there's a textual reason for
him to act, I think the way

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that humans might act more in real
life, not being direct, kind of

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just trying to adhere to the job
because this is the American experience. Oh

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but because the language had not evolved
necessarily in television to it's still a more

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theatrical acting style. And I'm just
talking out of my button, just kind

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of uh, because I have anything
the TV and film history that I know,

205
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But talk with Kenny talking out my
butt, I'm kiddy, I'm kiddy,

206
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chugging out my I'm kiddy. I
mean the spots main conflict here is

207
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duty talk about your butt? Speaking
of talk uh towards towards the end of

208
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the episode, what is my duty
to Starfleet? What is my duty to

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the enterprise? What is my duty
to my family? As that conflict?

210
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Yeah, and how many, especially
how many Here's going to be some grand

211
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standing right now about how many UH
men and women, But this is a

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show written by Jean Roddenberry, who's
a boy by boy. How many men

213
00:19:34.119 --> 00:19:37.880
UH served in World War Two and
then came home and never had never were

214
00:19:37.920 --> 00:19:44.359
able to talk about their feelings because
they hosted them exactly. And so we

215
00:19:44.839 --> 00:19:52.839
have this pervasive sense of toxic masculinity
that reaches its unruly tendrils throughout the fabric

216
00:19:52.880 --> 00:19:59.839
of society. And Spock is kind
of the emblematic of that, where he

217
00:20:00.079 --> 00:20:07.440
you cannot talk because his emotions are
so potent. A wonderful thing about the

218
00:20:07.480 --> 00:20:12.200
freaking editing where you're just cutting around
to reaction shots and then you just cut

219
00:20:12.240 --> 00:20:18.759
to a neutral Niemoy and you project
all of the emotions onto it because you're

220
00:20:18.839 --> 00:20:22.160
just like, oh, Spock,
no, Spock no, but his face

221
00:20:22.240 --> 00:20:26.079
is just completely unmoving. It's it's
an impossible task to ask him, an

222
00:20:26.119 --> 00:20:30.720
actor, to so underplay it,
and what a gift because you have to

223
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do so little, which I also
feel so weird whenever you see Nimoy and

224
00:20:37.559 --> 00:20:41.359
non vulcany rolls, and then also
later when you see Brent Spiner and non

225
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data roles, also feeling that because
Brent Speiner is really great at data because

226
00:20:48.119 --> 00:20:55.480
he's such an emotional actor everywhere else. This this says something to me about

227
00:20:56.799 --> 00:21:02.279
there's a lot of stuff here because
I like, like thematically, it would

228
00:21:02.279 --> 00:21:08.359
make sense. I am always here
to explore the toxic masculinity of not being

229
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able to explore your emotions. Having
come out pretty directly of deeply traumatic event

230
00:21:15.640 --> 00:21:21.400
that before you had only just you
know, okay, forties twenties eight,

231
00:21:21.400 --> 00:21:25.319
you know, just before the twenties
of the years before another deeply traumatic event,

232
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and that people were experiencing shell shock
which was trauma and PTSD ongoing trauma

233
00:21:36.920 --> 00:21:42.920
and the experience of that, the
trauma felt in their bodies that was never

234
00:21:44.000 --> 00:21:45.960
able to be expressed, to be
discussed, to have anywhere to go,

235
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manifested in a lot of anger and
rage and misplaced duty and a lot of

236
00:21:57.319 --> 00:22:03.000
hurt to the children that came from
them. And then you see that through

237
00:22:03.000 --> 00:22:07.799
intergenerational trauma. And even now we
still you know, we've got boomer parents

238
00:22:07.839 --> 00:22:11.720
who had silent generation, parents who
had greatest generation. You know, like

239
00:22:11.799 --> 00:22:17.200
we had these this kind of line
of trauma, and we're trying our best

240
00:22:17.200 --> 00:22:22.200
to interrupt it. And I do
wonder, Yeah, I think then about

241
00:22:22.279 --> 00:22:29.720
those moments of Spock. It almost
feels like a triumph when Spock expresses it,

242
00:22:30.279 --> 00:22:34.440
like when in that episode where he
thought truly that uh, that Kirk

243
00:22:34.559 --> 00:22:38.160
was dead and then he came and
he turns out he was alive. And

244
00:22:38.200 --> 00:22:42.880
when Spock truly not because he had
spores, not because of anything weird,

245
00:22:44.279 --> 00:22:49.039
but he was genuinely so joyful to
see his best friend and his boyfriend alive,

246
00:22:49.480 --> 00:22:55.559
and he like, like that that
smile on his face like could light

247
00:22:55.720 --> 00:22:59.279
a billion suns, you know what
I mean? And maybe, yeah,

248
00:22:59.279 --> 00:23:03.799
it's just there's moment of where it
feels hopeful. I I love it when

249
00:23:03.920 --> 00:23:07.880
Spock gets into emotion because you know
that he's so That's the whole point is

250
00:23:07.920 --> 00:23:15.279
that they're so so badly. But
it's just not the way, It's just

251
00:23:15.319 --> 00:23:18.960
not how you do it. It's
not appropriate. Asen I'm so excited for

252
00:23:19.000 --> 00:23:23.599
you to go through the arc of
Leonard nimoy as Spot because he goes on

253
00:23:23.920 --> 00:23:30.440
a fabulous journey. The other to
just talk about this episode just being filled

254
00:23:30.480 --> 00:23:36.279
with weighty uh looks at masculinity because
we've also got a rip roar and h

255
00:23:36.359 --> 00:23:41.599
we've got a murder mystery, We've
got ship fights. This episode is just

256
00:23:41.799 --> 00:23:48.960
it's it's chock full of great stuff. Being a freaking bottle episode. The

257
00:23:49.039 --> 00:23:57.880
whole thing takes place on the ship. This episode has everything a murder mystery,

258
00:24:00.680 --> 00:24:07.000
ship at warped ten, little gold
boys, drinking colored melons, knife

259
00:24:07.039 --> 00:24:18.079
fights, fake and Dorian's upside down
boys, daddy son issues, and naturally

260
00:24:18.319 --> 00:24:26.119
a guy with a broken antenna.
It is tremendous. It also has one

261
00:24:26.119 --> 00:24:30.200
of the funniest William Shatner performances I've
seen, which is him trying to pretend

262
00:24:30.240 --> 00:24:36.400
like he is not still hurt from
being stabbed by fake and Urian Enduran and

263
00:24:36.480 --> 00:24:48.640
Durian and and Dorian and Dorian and
and and from and Or and from Casi

264
00:24:48.680 --> 00:24:56.440
and Andor. And he's like trying
to convince Spock that he is okay enough

265
00:24:56.480 --> 00:24:59.720
to to helm the ship or held
the ship, but you know, direct

266
00:24:59.759 --> 00:25:03.079
the show, so he'll go and
do this surgery. It's also a medical

267
00:25:03.160 --> 00:25:07.920
drama Jesus Christ, Oh my gosh, where he does like a transfusion with

268
00:25:07.920 --> 00:25:11.920
his father and he comes in and
the way he's playing it, he's just

269
00:25:11.960 --> 00:25:22.880
like, I'm great, I'm doing
down here. How are you. He's

270
00:25:22.240 --> 00:25:26.119
like he is so close to finger
guns in it, He's just like,

271
00:25:26.000 --> 00:25:32.880
stock, get out of here,
just go You're great. It's so good.

272
00:25:33.359 --> 00:25:37.559
Shanner's funny. Shanner is very funny. He's so funny. Sorry to

273
00:25:37.640 --> 00:25:41.680
just keep going on and on.
No, it's a good episode. Uh.

274
00:25:42.240 --> 00:25:47.720
But also, you know we're speaking
about generational gaps, Yes we are,

275
00:25:48.039 --> 00:25:51.799
and we get a little bit of
that in our in our in our

276
00:25:51.839 --> 00:25:56.519
episodes that You Walk, we do
not to just skip to the thematic connections,

277
00:25:56.519 --> 00:25:59.039
but I'm just you know, segueing
to our first impressions that You Walk.

278
00:25:59.640 --> 00:26:07.839
I love it You're right, go
on, I just feel like I've

279
00:26:07.839 --> 00:26:15.559
talked a lot. No much like
but unlike Star Trek Star Wars as what

280
00:26:15.799 --> 00:26:21.359
to do, it's frequently involved in
trying to get reproir and adventures going on,

281
00:26:21.519 --> 00:26:26.039
and where these two, well,
the First Apprentice is more involved with

282
00:26:26.240 --> 00:26:32.160
trying to teach the lesson of don't
rush, we gotta be patient, as

283
00:26:32.200 --> 00:26:37.440
opposed to Linda Wolverton's episode. And
I just I just collected Linda Wolverton.

284
00:26:37.480 --> 00:26:41.640
I'm so glad that you did the
research on who the heck she is because

285
00:26:41.640 --> 00:26:45.839
I was just like, this is
not Paul Deini, this is this is

286
00:26:45.880 --> 00:26:52.119
not well, I've only been covering
this other writer for the past year or

287
00:26:52.119 --> 00:27:00.240
so. I mean both of them, both of the Walks episodes. I

288
00:27:00.240 --> 00:27:06.599
mean the First Apprentice deals much more
in the generational gaps that what I would

289
00:27:06.599 --> 00:27:12.000
call a little bit of perhaps trauma. But what do we? I think

290
00:27:12.039 --> 00:27:18.000
both do also a deal in what
do we owe each other? Oh?

291
00:27:18.079 --> 00:27:22.880
Does that make sense? Not yet? No, I'll find it. I'll

292
00:27:22.880 --> 00:27:30.240
find it. It's also fun to
watch this show again through the Kids on

293
00:27:30.319 --> 00:27:34.440
Bike's lens, which I am going
to keep returning to, and exercising that

294
00:27:34.480 --> 00:27:41.039
trope of you're a kid, kids
can't do shit, yeah, and they're

295
00:27:41.079 --> 00:27:48.960
like watch me yeah, in both
of them, and I'm wondering, also,

296
00:27:48.200 --> 00:27:53.279
not to interrupt you, but I'm
please, going to please how often

297
00:27:53.319 --> 00:27:59.279
that trope has been deployed of an
adult going, well, you WoT you

298
00:27:59.319 --> 00:28:06.920
can't do that? You're timy yell
bub bub. I think a lot.

299
00:28:06.960 --> 00:28:10.279
I think it's on bikes comes up
a lot because I which, and it

300
00:28:10.359 --> 00:28:15.319
is so as you've said before,
so identifiable, so like understandable even as

301
00:28:15.359 --> 00:28:19.599
an adult, because the reason kids
on bikes feel so engaging is because you

302
00:28:19.680 --> 00:28:22.799
know, even as an adult,
what it's like to not have agency and

303
00:28:22.839 --> 00:28:26.079
to fight back against something, or
to fight back against a structure that says

304
00:28:26.079 --> 00:28:30.119
that it knows more than you,
and you're like, I don't think,

305
00:28:30.200 --> 00:28:33.400
so I have to five for what
I think is just. And I might

306
00:28:33.440 --> 00:28:37.640
be thirty four, but like sometimes
I still feel the way I might have

307
00:28:37.680 --> 00:28:41.039
felt when I was nine and I
didn't have power. But at least now

308
00:28:41.160 --> 00:28:48.839
I have money so and a car, not just a bike. So instead

309
00:28:48.839 --> 00:28:52.640
of kids on bike, you are
adult. I'm an adult in car with

310
00:28:52.119 --> 00:29:02.680
paycheck but no real institutional power in
I mean, this happens a lot in

311
00:29:02.759 --> 00:29:06.319
Ewoks, and it is the it's
never one of us, it's always all

312
00:29:06.319 --> 00:29:11.880
of us together. So one of
us might be the one to try to

313
00:29:11.039 --> 00:29:18.440
capture the Hannah deck and then we
find ourselves in a weird situation, but

314
00:29:18.680 --> 00:29:22.720
like our friends will come to find
us to be with us, to save

315
00:29:22.839 --> 00:29:26.480
us because they love us. And
in the second one, too, there

316
00:29:26.559 --> 00:29:33.160
is this funny bit because Zarak does
this thing where he's like, will defeat

317
00:29:33.240 --> 00:29:38.960
me, and it's he sees t
Bow and this little reflection and so he's

318
00:29:38.960 --> 00:29:41.359
like, cool, I'll trick him, right, And then he's like this

319
00:29:41.400 --> 00:29:47.880
little doufis this is the one that
defeats me, and he's just like a

320
00:29:47.880 --> 00:29:53.000
bur I'm a little body. And
then it's like almost the sort of but

321
00:29:53.759 --> 00:29:59.839
it's like he Harry Potter, is
it. It's like Harry Potter's power is

322
00:30:00.920 --> 00:30:08.839
he has friends and it's really good
at expelliarmis like basically like he's like,

323
00:30:11.000 --> 00:30:14.960
it's not just that it's te Bow, it's that it's t Bow supported by

324
00:30:15.319 --> 00:30:22.039
the people who love him, plus
low Gray and a little simple trick.

325
00:30:25.119 --> 00:30:30.480
Yeah, Nissa, who is Hermione
for sure. Uh, and requisite fucked

326
00:30:30.559 --> 00:30:36.559
joe In, but it's just very
very Harry Potter of it all, and

327
00:30:36.599 --> 00:30:41.559
that's why he defeats him like with
just like the simple magic and friendship,

328
00:30:41.799 --> 00:30:45.000
you know. And I just so
I think that there is a real commitment

329
00:30:45.039 --> 00:30:48.599
of like we've got each other's backs, and we owe what do we owe

330
00:30:48.599 --> 00:30:52.160
each other? And we owe each
other love and support and that I will

331
00:30:52.200 --> 00:30:53.799
be there for you even if I'm
making fun of you. I love you

332
00:30:53.839 --> 00:31:03.839
so much I will try to save
you. Speaking of commitment, Kathleen Kennedy,

333
00:31:03.119 --> 00:31:11.480
Yeah, Lucasfilm. Yeah, look, yeah, her her tenure in

334
00:31:11.559 --> 00:31:18.960
charge of Star Wars mixed, but
okay, if she had honest to God

335
00:31:18.079 --> 00:31:26.559
courage, yeah, she would bring
the miphs back. Fucking love the mephs.

336
00:31:26.680 --> 00:31:30.000
We stand a mimph. I what
are they? Mice? Little mice

337
00:31:30.039 --> 00:31:34.839
creatures. No, they're little boys, like little tiny mice boys, little

338
00:31:34.880 --> 00:31:38.799
tiny mice boys. Their voices.
Have you ever seen that guy on TikTok

339
00:31:38.839 --> 00:31:42.839
who like voices his cats, And
he's got like four cats and they're all

340
00:31:42.880 --> 00:31:48.799
like hey, dad, dad,
and one of them is like dad.

341
00:31:48.160 --> 00:31:52.720
One of them just says that voice. That's what they reminded me of I

342
00:31:52.759 --> 00:31:57.440
realized that's why I could not stop
laughing at them. The Myphs love chanting

343
00:31:57.480 --> 00:32:02.559
almost as much as me. Whenever
Wicket says cavark, they're like, oh,

344
00:32:02.640 --> 00:32:05.480
yeah, that sounds good. Comark, come on, come on,

345
00:32:05.640 --> 00:32:09.079
come Barck, co work, come
Bark. And then later when they're like

346
00:32:09.079 --> 00:32:14.000
trying to get them to perform,
don't they yell something else? Probably I

347
00:32:14.000 --> 00:32:16.880
didn't write that part down. I
did write down that one of their names

348
00:32:17.000 --> 00:32:24.000
is uh Thrasher Thrasher, the Mimph
Thrasher than Memph. There's also Smasher.

349
00:32:24.160 --> 00:32:30.000
There's also Smasher than Memph Crasher Smasher. They are a little mouse boys.

350
00:32:30.279 --> 00:32:36.279
They're a little mouse boys. I
like the pitch was, what if there

351
00:32:36.359 --> 00:32:40.319
was something smaller than hewaks. I
fucking love them. And then there's you

352
00:32:40.319 --> 00:32:45.519
know, Wicket's chasing something that's bigger
than he walks, so there's even big

353
00:32:45.720 --> 00:32:50.200
bigger honker, just a bigger honker. There's a bigger honker chasing the little

354
00:32:50.200 --> 00:32:54.519
boys. It's like an always a
bigger fish kind of situation. I don't

355
00:32:54.519 --> 00:33:00.680
get. In the film Star Wars, episode one of the Phantom Menace,

356
00:33:00.519 --> 00:33:06.279
they're in the core of Naboo,
and they're almost eaten by a sea creature,

357
00:33:06.680 --> 00:33:09.240
and that sea creatures eat by another
sea creature, and then Qui gon

358
00:33:09.279 --> 00:33:21.319
Din goes there's always a big a
fish. That's where the phrase originated.

359
00:33:21.839 --> 00:33:24.599
I don't know. I don't go
into the deep sea much. We should

360
00:33:24.599 --> 00:33:29.279
set that as a patreongle. Oh
my god, I really don't want to.

361
00:33:29.319 --> 00:33:32.160
It's so scary. I don't want
to go to the deeper sea.

362
00:33:34.160 --> 00:33:38.519
Sometimes I'll watch a lot of really
scary like videos of like people like under

363
00:33:38.559 --> 00:33:45.440
sea stuff or like there's like a
phobia of this that's like deep ocean or

364
00:33:45.480 --> 00:33:46.920
like the ocean stuff, and I
will watch it. Or I'll watch like

365
00:33:47.079 --> 00:33:53.440
boats out on just like the open
sea on big waves. Like it's so

366
00:33:53.559 --> 00:33:59.559
much and I hate it so much. Speaking of hating so much, I

367
00:33:59.559 --> 00:34:05.680
think we our best villain in e
Walk's yet the evil e Walk sorce or

368
00:34:05.759 --> 00:34:09.239
is Eric? Okay, well,
don't you ever forget about more Rag?

369
00:34:09.559 --> 00:34:14.800
But yes, go on? What
if it? What if there was an

370
00:34:14.840 --> 00:34:19.199
evil you walk? You walk this
evil? Oh that's true. Morag wasn't

371
00:34:19.199 --> 00:34:24.480
any walk. He was. He's
evil. He wants he wants to take

372
00:34:24.519 --> 00:34:38.960
the quick and easy path, lifting
big rocks and throwing them it. Yeah,

373
00:34:39.000 --> 00:34:43.840
his plan was weird, Like I
was not sure. I guess he

374
00:34:43.880 --> 00:34:45.840
was trying to see what Tibo was
capable of. Oh, I'm just I'm

375
00:34:45.840 --> 00:34:52.559
just drawing more parallels from oh Star
Wars in general. Oh, I did

376
00:34:52.559 --> 00:34:57.880
not realize, that's what I feel
like that. And then the previous episode

377
00:34:58.000 --> 00:35:00.920
where Logray used the force. Oh
my god, Kenny, I didn't realize.

378
00:35:00.920 --> 00:35:04.079
I thought that you were just saying
stuff. But I was like,

379
00:35:04.199 --> 00:35:07.960
yeah, Kenny, you know that's
right, the thing that you're on this

380
00:35:07.039 --> 00:35:14.639
podcast to champion. Okay, you
see right, I forgot never seen the

381
00:35:14.679 --> 00:35:19.679
original trilogy. You just watched episode
one sixty four times. I've watched it

382
00:35:19.760 --> 00:35:28.440
so many times, and every time
there's a bigger fish. Yes, yes,

383
00:35:28.719 --> 00:35:31.559
he takes the quick and easy pet. Well, okay, I'm sorry.

384
00:35:31.920 --> 00:35:37.039
Are you saying that's like Luke?
I'm saying that Tebow is more like

385
00:35:37.119 --> 00:35:39.119
Luke Tebow being like, I mean, yeah, I guess he is a

386
00:35:39.119 --> 00:35:44.519
little bit like. And then Zaric, Yes, you know, Zaric is

387
00:35:44.559 --> 00:35:52.800
the tortured apprentice that is Chief low
Gray. You know what, You're right?

388
00:35:53.800 --> 00:36:00.360
And also Tebow has friends I love
him. Yeah, and while he

389
00:36:00.480 --> 00:36:07.679
is hanging from an antenna in below
Cloud City, his friends will come back

390
00:36:07.679 --> 00:36:13.360
to get him and save him.
Yeah, that is kind of funny.

391
00:36:13.440 --> 00:36:15.440
You're right, Like it does feel
like you walks whether we're pulling it or

392
00:36:15.480 --> 00:36:23.400
not, like it's wait a second, yeah, Skywalker, Uh huh uh

393
00:36:24.159 --> 00:36:34.280
what the Wicked would be the Han
and Lataro would obviously be the Chewbacca.

394
00:36:34.880 --> 00:36:38.360
I think latar is C three p
O but with more power. You know,

395
00:36:39.000 --> 00:36:45.639
she's got like she's got the like
mean sass kind of thing. She's

396
00:36:45.679 --> 00:36:49.679
pretty Judge can be pretty, sassy, pretty judging. That's true. You're

397
00:36:49.760 --> 00:36:54.400
right. And they have fabulous fur. Yeah they do. I forgot that.

398
00:36:54.440 --> 00:36:59.639
We're both of them have great style. Have you ever seen someone pull

399
00:36:59.679 --> 00:37:04.079
off a b and lea letroubaka camp
No? No, And it's true.

400
00:37:04.119 --> 00:37:06.679
He walks out really good style.
Latara is a really good style. She's

401
00:37:06.679 --> 00:37:12.039
always wearing jewels. Yeah, no, you know what, You're not wrong.

402
00:37:12.199 --> 00:37:14.400
You're not wrong. Is this funny
because if we go by like that?

403
00:37:15.599 --> 00:37:17.360
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I
think I think you're right. I

404
00:37:17.400 --> 00:37:22.199
think in this way, I guess
Wicked could also. I think I think

405
00:37:22.239 --> 00:37:25.440
you're right that Wicked does match more
with Han than he does with Luke in

406
00:37:25.559 --> 00:37:31.400
terms of vibes. He's it does
have a similar like because it doesn't have

407
00:37:31.440 --> 00:37:35.639
to match like if Wicked is your
like, he's not our soul, like

408
00:37:36.960 --> 00:37:42.920
Hero's journey, child like they all
are like they all have focus in something

409
00:37:42.920 --> 00:37:47.079
they're trying to achieve. So and
he has that kind of roguish charm and

410
00:37:47.199 --> 00:37:53.559
quality to him. I think you're
right. I love that isn't that fun

411
00:37:54.480 --> 00:38:01.800
and much like unlike Anakin, but
like the Emperor, Sarah does fall into

412
00:38:02.039 --> 00:38:08.599
a big hole with a weird sort
of like well thing at the bottom.

413
00:38:08.639 --> 00:38:14.440
So I didn't even think of that
while I was watching it. Kenny,

414
00:38:15.400 --> 00:38:20.320
what are you writing down? Writing
down notes for the episode notes for whenever

415
00:38:20.679 --> 00:38:25.840
episode? Oh? Are you writing
them by hand instead of on the on

416
00:38:25.920 --> 00:38:30.679
the on the online internet? I
am, well, because I'm recording at

417
00:38:30.679 --> 00:38:35.920
the closet that's supposed to my usual
setup. It's really how many closets are

418
00:38:35.920 --> 00:38:39.480
there that one doesn't have any clothes
in it? Uh. I would love

419
00:38:39.559 --> 00:38:43.599
to take you around all of the
closets that are here. There's a closet

420
00:38:43.639 --> 00:38:46.159
that's so big you could put a
bad in It's great for real, for

421
00:38:46.239 --> 00:38:51.639
real, this is a closet talk. I mean it could be closet talk.

422
00:38:53.440 --> 00:38:58.360
We could start closet talk. Here's
what both of these episodes happen.

423
00:38:58.440 --> 00:39:07.119
Comic episodes have a character named Eric, but ones with the Z sure say

424
00:39:07.159 --> 00:39:13.000
it. If we were saying it
in Spanish, one would be Serrik,

425
00:39:13.679 --> 00:39:20.719
one would be Sarah in Spain Spanish. Did you know that that lisp came

426
00:39:21.000 --> 00:39:23.840
because like some king spoke with this
lisp and then it became fashionable to speak

427
00:39:23.880 --> 00:39:28.920
it with like it's like either the
Z or That's how weird is it that

428
00:39:28.960 --> 00:39:37.280
both of these episodes have a character? Sorry I did Sarah once Sarah Sarah

429
00:39:37.840 --> 00:39:44.800
Sarah Sarah Sarah Sarah two very different
characters. And if you don't watching the

430
00:39:44.840 --> 00:39:47.519
Bastille Day episode of Battlestar Galactica,
we'd be watching an episode with a character

431
00:39:47.599 --> 00:39:57.639
named Tom's Eric or not. I
Love I Love anyway. Yes, I

432
00:39:57.639 --> 00:40:00.840
didn't even think, Kenny, you're
out here no things. I am so

433
00:40:00.960 --> 00:40:07.440
preoccupied with thinking about the relationship with
my father. I didn't even think about

434
00:40:07.559 --> 00:40:12.480
that. There is a well,
I mean obviously I've talked about it before.

435
00:40:13.119 --> 00:40:15.480
Well, we'll bring it to the
four both of the All of these

436
00:40:15.519 --> 00:40:22.079
episodes are about in some way the
generation gap, the generation gap being a

437
00:40:22.079 --> 00:40:30.440
motivating factor in our first episode,
Gone with the memphs Our second episode the

438
00:40:30.480 --> 00:40:36.079
First Apprentice, the generation gap the
failure to communicate with the first Apprentice and

439
00:40:36.199 --> 00:40:42.480
leading them accidentally down towards a dark
path. And the later generation kind of

440
00:40:42.679 --> 00:40:49.800
or the newer generation being a bit
more impatient versus the older generation sticking with

441
00:40:49.840 --> 00:40:53.679
traditions and whatnot. And then yeah, with Journey Debabo. According to DC

442
00:40:53.840 --> 00:41:00.199
Fontana, she wanted to write about
the lack of communication and this new you

443
00:41:00.480 --> 00:41:07.559
in vogue phrase in the nineteen sixties
called the generational gap. Holy fuck okay,

444
00:41:07.679 --> 00:41:12.960
DC, my girl. It was
also interesting reading these are the voyages

445
00:41:14.199 --> 00:41:19.599
this episode was we've talked about in
previous episodes. Not all of these episodes

446
00:41:19.639 --> 00:41:25.400
are pretty much are like fully one
person. But according to that according to

447
00:41:25.440 --> 00:41:30.920
this chapter, basically a DC Fontana
episode from page one to end. One

448
00:41:30.960 --> 00:41:37.079
scene that roden Berry added some light
rewrites from Genekoon, but other than that,

449
00:41:37.360 --> 00:41:45.800
this episode full Fontana. It's interesting. I'm always agreed, Yes,

450
00:41:45.920 --> 00:41:51.679
it is interesting. One of the
best parts of the episode is when something

451
00:41:51.800 --> 00:41:57.000
terrible happens and Spock's like interesting and
then Sarah finds out and he goes interesting,

452
00:42:00.639 --> 00:42:05.039
which is so what I find to
be always fun in these moments is

453
00:42:05.079 --> 00:42:10.000
to hear from these are the voyages, what the what like the author's intent

454
00:42:10.280 --> 00:42:14.280
was, and then what we got
out of it. Yeah, because sometimes

455
00:42:14.280 --> 00:42:15.880
it's not the same. Sometimes I
have a different kind of impression from it.

456
00:42:16.239 --> 00:42:20.880
But hearing that is you know,
like sometimes they're like, this is

457
00:42:20.920 --> 00:42:24.440
about interracial relationships and you're like,
you failed. Yeah, it was.

458
00:42:24.639 --> 00:42:29.599
It was weird for a Menagerie episode
where you were just like, I think

459
00:42:29.599 --> 00:42:31.760
the takeaway is that zoos are fun. Mm hmm. That is what I

460
00:42:31.800 --> 00:42:36.920
said. I'm on you can hear
me. You can go back and find

461
00:42:36.960 --> 00:42:40.920
that recording and in that I say, Jews are great, zoos are great.

462
00:42:42.639 --> 00:42:45.960
That's so gets exactly how I sounded. I was just like, lock

463
00:42:45.039 --> 00:42:51.400
those penguins up. Leah doesn't like, I want to redo that. Yeah,

464
00:42:51.880 --> 00:42:59.960
Girafts don't deserve to be brave.
Yeah, because in this case,

465
00:43:00.960 --> 00:43:05.480
it is so much is happening in
this episode in a way where everything does

466
00:43:05.599 --> 00:43:09.440
feel like is logically leading to something, though it should come off the rails.

467
00:43:09.519 --> 00:43:15.000
This episode is doing so much.
There's so much plot. Yes,

468
00:43:15.199 --> 00:43:19.400
in this episode, there's so many
events happening. I feel like all of

469
00:43:19.400 --> 00:43:22.000
the characters, and by all of
the characters, I mean Kirk, Spock

470
00:43:22.000 --> 00:43:34.880
and McCoy, never Ahura Oh Bair
have something meaningful to do and to contribute.

471
00:43:35.039 --> 00:43:37.159
I mean there's the A plot with
spots Seric and Amanda, and there's

472
00:43:37.159 --> 00:43:42.199
the B plot with the diplomatic conference. There's the C plot with the ship

473
00:43:42.199 --> 00:43:45.480
that's buzzing around, and then there's
the D plot with Sarah and Is waltering

474
00:43:45.519 --> 00:43:52.079
Hell, well, but you're exactly
right, and like there's so of course

475
00:43:52.119 --> 00:43:55.920
we start with the diplomats are all
here because we're trying to see if we

476
00:43:57.039 --> 00:44:01.960
should let Corydon into the generation.
Uh yeah, you believe I've done this

477
00:44:02.039 --> 00:44:08.920
long without saying yeah, favorite Star
Trek Trope. Yeah, diplomats arguing,

478
00:44:09.800 --> 00:44:13.719
I yeah, there's a lot of
this. There's a lot of it on

479
00:44:13.800 --> 00:44:15.960
this one. I'm so excited to
get to Star Trek four just so we

480
00:44:15.960 --> 00:44:23.119
can meet my favorite diplomat. I'm
also thrilled. So there's all these diplomats

481
00:44:23.199 --> 00:44:28.360
on the ship together, which is
Wisebox Dad is there. Yeah, there's

482
00:44:28.360 --> 00:44:34.719
a purple girl. H Yeah,
there's some little people. There are some

483
00:44:34.880 --> 00:44:39.679
gold little people, one of which
was the mayor of munchkin Land. Oh

484
00:44:39.719 --> 00:44:46.280
cool, it's fun. There's a
lot girl. There's some white boys with

485
00:44:46.679 --> 00:44:52.760
big white wigs. Yeah. And
then also we get Neandorians and the Taller

486
00:44:52.880 --> 00:44:57.559
Rids. It's pretty fun Taller Ride. Yeah. So they're all there and

487
00:44:57.559 --> 00:45:04.239
they're all fun. And then but
they're there so that you can have the

488
00:45:04.360 --> 00:45:08.559
tension of having Spock's parents there for
a reason. But then there's this murder

489
00:45:08.599 --> 00:45:15.199
plot. So TELLERI dies or pig
Guy as I called him, uh,

490
00:45:15.280 --> 00:45:22.320
right after having this fight with Sarah. So he is suspected. But then

491
00:45:22.440 --> 00:45:24.519
yeah, like so at first I
was like what is going on? And

492
00:45:24.559 --> 00:45:27.960
then so now it's like, okay, Well then he's like, oh,

493
00:45:28.039 --> 00:45:30.079
turns out he has heart problems,
and I was like Jesus Christ. Uh

494
00:45:30.119 --> 00:45:32.639
and but the only way to help
him is so it Spock can help him,

495
00:45:32.639 --> 00:45:36.119
and I'm like okay. So there's
like a tension there. But then

496
00:45:36.159 --> 00:45:40.719
suddenly there's a knife fight with the
Sandorian and Douran and and and and Kirk,

497
00:45:40.760 --> 00:45:43.800
and I'm like, why is this
happening, and then it occurs to

498
00:45:43.800 --> 00:45:46.840
me, Oh, it's so that
he cannot now man the ship, and

499
00:45:46.880 --> 00:45:51.840
now Spock has to make a choice
between saving his father and protecting the ship

500
00:45:52.119 --> 00:45:54.599
while there is an actual threat against
it. So even though there's so much

501
00:45:54.599 --> 00:45:58.679
happening, it all makes sense when
they slot them all together and all has

502
00:45:58.679 --> 00:46:01.239
a logical flow, while we also
still being true to an emotional core and

503
00:46:01.280 --> 00:46:07.360
that's why it works. And then
to read that basically from the first draft,

504
00:46:07.440 --> 00:46:13.920
this episode is unchanged cool. That's
crazy. This episode should not work.

505
00:46:14.239 --> 00:46:20.119
And the fact that DC Fontiana Dorothy
Fontana just bang this out, She's

506
00:46:20.199 --> 00:46:22.719
just like, Okay, great,
I'll just fart out an iconic episode of

507
00:46:22.760 --> 00:46:29.840
Star Trek yep. And also she
just I mean, she is the person

508
00:46:29.960 --> 00:46:36.840
that codifies whose Spock is the best
and really understands repressed masculinity in such a

509
00:46:37.039 --> 00:46:46.679
profound way and understands what is attractive
about that on a dramatic level. Jesus

510
00:46:46.760 --> 00:46:52.920
Christ. It and also you know, uh makes Leonard Nimoy into a star

511
00:46:53.199 --> 00:47:00.679
that then helps kickstart the Kirk slash
Spock genre and slash fiction in general.

512
00:47:00.239 --> 00:47:09.440
Yeah, thank you, DC.
Yeah, I mean there is there's a

513
00:47:09.519 --> 00:47:17.800
reason why it is a trope to
have an emotionally withholding person, typically a

514
00:47:17.880 --> 00:47:24.400
man, and to like be excited
about the idea of like fixing that person

515
00:47:24.519 --> 00:47:30.159
or like that is attractive because it's
like these like these like especially that it's

516
00:47:30.159 --> 00:47:36.280
almost like I like to call it
the black cat like golden retriever dynamic of

517
00:47:36.360 --> 00:47:39.519
like if that is always a fun
pairing because you have a sort of like

518
00:47:40.239 --> 00:47:44.280
ugh. So then when you do
start to get the emotionality, it feels

519
00:47:44.320 --> 00:47:47.760
so good, like a little treat
like it just gained you cheat and did

520
00:47:47.760 --> 00:47:50.960
I get it out of treats?
Because then at on a certain point you're

521
00:47:50.960 --> 00:47:52.199
like, wow, okay, that's
not a healthy relationship. We have to

522
00:47:52.199 --> 00:47:54.840
start working on our feelings and doing
a lot more therapeutic work. But it's

523
00:47:55.199 --> 00:48:01.800
until then, great, great job
out. Yeah. Speaking of great job,

524
00:48:02.480 --> 00:48:07.039
you're telling me that I'm doing great
connections in great research. Meanwhile,

525
00:48:07.320 --> 00:48:13.280
you're able to connect the fact that
we got DC Fontan and Linda Wolverton writing

526
00:48:13.320 --> 00:48:15.559
episodes this week, and you said
that you've got a tank and a perspective

527
00:48:15.599 --> 00:48:21.800
on that. Oh no, I
mean yeah, So I don't have a

528
00:48:21.800 --> 00:48:24.079
particularly well thought out one. I
think I was just delighted to see that

529
00:48:24.159 --> 00:48:29.280
it was not just like three cis
white men as always you give us your

530
00:48:29.320 --> 00:48:34.360
thesis, why are women better?
They're not. They're certainly not, especially

531
00:48:34.440 --> 00:48:40.679
not white women, because they're still
often reinforcing the toxic, masculine, white

532
00:48:40.679 --> 00:48:49.320
supremacist views of the world due to
a lack of resources and anyway, I

533
00:48:49.320 --> 00:48:52.519
do not think that inherently having women
writers is better, but I do think

534
00:48:53.000 --> 00:48:58.960
within this context it is very much
a relief and it does introduce what I

535
00:48:58.960 --> 00:49:02.440
imagine our different person actives, especially
at this point when basically you are seeing

536
00:49:02.440 --> 00:49:07.079
our white men as writers and directors. So and I thought, I just

537
00:49:07.119 --> 00:49:09.440
feel like I was watching that Ewoks
episode and I could I could feel that

538
00:49:09.480 --> 00:49:12.760
it was a little different, Like
the style of it felt like it was

539
00:49:12.840 --> 00:49:15.599
going. It was being it was
taking more risks, like a lot more

540
00:49:15.639 --> 00:49:20.599
with humor. That was interesting.
And I could tell before even realizing it

541
00:49:20.599 --> 00:49:24.400
was DC Fontana. I was like, every time something feels fundamentally more like

542
00:49:24.760 --> 00:49:29.920
tied into the emotionality of a character
and truly loving the interiority of them,

543
00:49:30.400 --> 00:49:32.800
I'm like, oh, it's DC, you know, like it's you again,

544
00:49:32.880 --> 00:49:42.280
Hey, so that's that's the thesis. The thesis is obviously more diversity

545
00:49:42.480 --> 00:49:49.280
like white women does not diversity make
but think fuck. That's my thesis.

546
00:49:50.199 --> 00:49:54.920
Speaking of think fuck, I think
it's time to go to our favorite fuckable

547
00:49:54.920 --> 00:50:04.639
pairings in our special segments? What
do we call it? I started ship

548
00:50:04.679 --> 00:50:13.760
it so a long time ago.
Start dating this week. I quoted a

549
00:50:13.840 --> 00:50:17.679
boat, I dated a geek,
but none of them could warp my drive

550
00:50:17.920 --> 00:50:27.840
into hyper space. The best of
both worlds kept me in the second place.

551
00:50:30.400 --> 00:50:37.559
Captain's log on a halla kron.
I wanted anog. I penned a

552
00:50:37.559 --> 00:50:52.119
song seventeen more minutes advise in super
high def aboard the USS Enterprise dt' don't

553
00:50:52.159 --> 00:50:58.159
you take my walk lighter and clip
it? Don't you take my wretchered buddy

554
00:50:58.239 --> 00:51:05.679
and nip it spill the tea.
I'm gonna sip bit a starship. Okay,

555
00:51:05.760 --> 00:51:07.880
let me think? Okay, wait
wait wait wait wait wait. Of

556
00:51:07.960 --> 00:51:12.599
course, of course we will pick
our favorite vehicles slash ships as well as

557
00:51:12.639 --> 00:51:16.840
our favorite romantic ships. So I
will tell you I do have a favorite

558
00:51:17.000 --> 00:51:22.880
vehicle that might be your same favorite
vehicle from Ewoks? All right, from

559
00:51:22.239 --> 00:51:29.119
uh from Ewoks? I know there
were some fabulous ships in the Star Trek

560
00:51:29.199 --> 00:51:32.840
episode incredible. There was shuttles,
and I know your beautiful take on shuttles.

561
00:51:32.960 --> 00:51:37.519
There's like the Columbus, so good. Uh, fabulous stuff, right.

562
00:51:37.159 --> 00:51:47.880
I fucking loved Xeric's like bat wings. Yes, they were extraordinary.

563
00:51:49.519 --> 00:51:52.679
Uh, they like came down.
It wasn't like their typical sort of like

564
00:51:52.719 --> 00:51:57.039
skin gliders things. It was like
they came to him like he was Batman

565
00:51:57.519 --> 00:52:01.159
and and and sort of like fit
on him and then swooped away as if

566
00:52:01.159 --> 00:52:05.719
he could truly fly. It's not
even like he jumped off a cliff.

567
00:52:05.760 --> 00:52:07.639
It's just like they can fly.
And I guess he's magic, so maybe

568
00:52:07.639 --> 00:52:15.400
that's why. But it was great. I think I wrote I love that.

569
00:52:19.320 --> 00:52:21.800
I did write a lot of oh
my god, I love this battie.

570
00:52:21.880 --> 00:52:29.079
Oh my god, his kite thing. So it's fabulous. So that's

571
00:52:29.119 --> 00:52:36.599
mine. That is my friend me
Walks fucking loved it. I you already

572
00:52:36.599 --> 00:52:38.480
did mention the Columbus. I was
going to go with that one, but

573
00:52:38.599 --> 00:52:46.360
also I wasn't. I'm not ending
up going with that. I am going

574
00:52:46.440 --> 00:52:52.800
with the Ryan Ship, as featured
in the remastered Star Trek The original series

575
00:52:52.840 --> 00:52:57.719
episode Journey to Babel and I'll tell
you why. Yeah, yes, please,

576
00:52:58.320 --> 00:53:01.320
it's a rain ship. What it's
got a little ring? Oh,

577
00:53:01.360 --> 00:53:05.719
it is a ring ship. Yes, it's a little ring. And that

578
00:53:05.719 --> 00:53:12.920
that kind of design etho, hearkens
back to original designs of the Enterprise that

579
00:53:12.960 --> 00:53:17.119
Matt Jeffres did in sketching what the
heck Enterprise was going to look like.

580
00:53:17.159 --> 00:53:21.800
That wasn't a rocket ship and wasn't
looking like anything else. That he knew

581
00:53:22.320 --> 00:53:28.599
that the engines had to just look
different, couldn't look like anything. And

582
00:53:28.679 --> 00:53:31.719
not only that, but he understood
that something with that amount of power had

583
00:53:31.719 --> 00:53:36.960
to be way far away from the
fuselage because it would be extremely dangerous.

584
00:53:37.079 --> 00:53:43.760
Which is why there's a big ring, fabulous, and it's extending away from

585
00:53:44.000 --> 00:53:47.760
the habitable area. And that's why
the new cells on the Enterprise or positioned

586
00:53:49.039 --> 00:53:52.800
that way, because they're supposed to
be like in the event that bad stuff

587
00:53:52.800 --> 00:53:58.320
happens, you can just pop the
new cells off and just to use auxiliary

588
00:53:58.360 --> 00:54:04.039
power to just kind of get away
from them. Oh my god, I

589
00:54:04.119 --> 00:54:08.039
love that. And then I believe
I'm remembering correctly. It's incorporating some elements

590
00:54:08.079 --> 00:54:15.280
from probably the animated series and maybe
enterprised at this point because the remastered version

591
00:54:15.320 --> 00:54:21.360
did come out after all of those
things, where there were some Orion designs.

592
00:54:21.400 --> 00:54:24.199
The original version of Death, because
I did watch the remastered version on

593
00:54:24.719 --> 00:54:29.920
Paramount Plus, didn't pop in my
blue rays. The original version I think

594
00:54:30.119 --> 00:54:32.280
was just a big ball of light, which a big face. Oh so

595
00:54:32.400 --> 00:54:37.760
great. I have seen I've seen
a lot of ring designs in things like

596
00:54:37.800 --> 00:54:40.440
space stations like two thousand and one, and a lot of that is like

597
00:54:40.920 --> 00:54:45.159
generation of gravity, is it like
kind of that, So I've seen that

598
00:54:45.519 --> 00:54:50.599
before, but not much for a
ship. Also, we didn't even mention

599
00:54:50.639 --> 00:54:55.119
it that it turns out that it
wasn't an Andorian, It was an Orion

600
00:54:55.320 --> 00:55:00.239
who had been genetically altered to look
like an Durian yea, which I don't

601
00:55:00.239 --> 00:55:04.079
know if we've talked about orions,
yeah, but we have in we have,

602
00:55:04.239 --> 00:55:07.679
I mean Azerie, and we talked
about the fact that the green woman

603
00:55:07.239 --> 00:55:13.280
couldn't necessarily be a blue woman because
it was co opting uh vaguely Middle Eastern.

604
00:55:13.800 --> 00:55:16.400
Oh. I forgot that we had
already design and they couldn't make it

605
00:55:16.400 --> 00:55:23.239
blue because that was already a trope. But no, got blue. Yeah,

606
00:55:23.400 --> 00:55:29.679
I've I don't know everything about orions
because of lower decks. So that's

607
00:55:29.719 --> 00:55:35.000
great. Fuck, it's so good. It's so it's a great ship and

608
00:55:35.039 --> 00:55:37.639
I love that kind of stuff.
Is it as good as bat wings?

609
00:55:37.760 --> 00:55:45.119
Probably not? No, no,
no, no, okay, favorite romantic

610
00:55:45.400 --> 00:55:52.880
ships. I'm going to go pretty
straightforward on this and say Sarah and Amanda

611
00:55:54.920 --> 00:56:02.280
beat the classics. It's a classic. And I don't really like the dynamic

612
00:56:02.320 --> 00:56:07.360
of like Vulcan marriage stuff. And
there's a bit of a like, well

613
00:56:07.400 --> 00:56:08.440
you know, he says it,
that's what it is. But they have

614
00:56:08.599 --> 00:56:13.760
this cute little two finger thing that
they do and they go two finger to

615
00:56:13.840 --> 00:56:20.880
two two finger, and there's just
so many moments of like gentleness and love.

616
00:56:22.360 --> 00:56:25.320
Yeah, if I remember this correctly, that was developed with Mark Leonard

617
00:56:25.360 --> 00:56:30.960
and Jane Wyatt and understanding that Vulcans
are cold and distant people, so even

618
00:56:31.599 --> 00:56:38.199
two finger touch would be electric.
And it is something something that sparse can

619
00:56:38.280 --> 00:56:45.360
feel alien and very intimate. It's
like a regency era thing. It's like

620
00:56:45.440 --> 00:56:50.159
sexy just to see a heel or
like or an ankle or it's a like

621
00:56:50.280 --> 00:56:55.760
brush fingertips like something about it.
Yeah, is electric, and like there

622
00:56:55.840 --> 00:57:00.480
is a moment where Amanda is really
just letting it out, like she is

623
00:57:00.559 --> 00:57:06.800
like fuck this like Jesus Christ.
And you can kind of see him like

624
00:57:06.880 --> 00:57:09.000
it's just you see them gently sort
of like he's kind of like, oh,

625
00:57:09.079 --> 00:57:13.719
you know, and like they touch
fingers and she kind of laughs,

626
00:57:13.760 --> 00:57:22.440
and it's just so like marriage is
so many things, and I think there's

627
00:57:22.719 --> 00:57:27.519
just a lot of like, you
know, you you are like people are

628
00:57:27.639 --> 00:57:35.079
people, and we are always going
to be like fucking trying hard and just

629
00:57:35.159 --> 00:57:40.280
who we are. And it's just
about a lot of forgiveness and compassion for

630
00:57:40.320 --> 00:57:45.199
yourself and for each other and like
the humanity of one another. And I

631
00:57:45.280 --> 00:57:50.920
just feel like that's what I saw
in that a lot of So that's great.

632
00:57:50.960 --> 00:58:01.480
My ship is seric in a Bastard
Gab crying over here. Don't tell

633
00:58:01.519 --> 00:58:07.800
me that Ambassadard Gab isn't bringing real
friends to lovers, dynamic enemies to lovers,

634
00:58:08.079 --> 00:58:14.960
you do know. I love that
he is mad at Sarah because he's

635
00:58:15.159 --> 00:58:22.679
voting for Cordan to get accepted,
because Corydan needs diplomatic protection so pirates don't

636
00:58:22.719 --> 00:58:28.559
just steal their unlimited dialeteum. While
Gab is just like, but there's a

637
00:58:28.599 --> 00:58:31.480
reason. Look, there's a reason
that Gab keeps bothering Sarah because you've got

638
00:58:31.480 --> 00:58:37.960
to know his opinion. Gab's so
interested, probably because Sarah is a little

639
00:58:37.960 --> 00:58:42.079
bit I don't know. There's just
something about the golden glisten of his skin

640
00:58:42.239 --> 00:58:47.239
that's probably activating gas, a little
snoop glisten that comes from heart failure,

641
00:58:51.599 --> 00:59:00.840
sweating because he's dying. Gab's like
hot and then he himself died. This

642
00:59:00.920 --> 00:59:05.559
little pay wants to go to market. I was like, I can tell

643
00:59:05.599 --> 00:59:13.679
Sarah is probably gonna die, so
I'll die first. That's love, baby,

644
00:59:14.440 --> 00:59:17.199
That is love, And obviously we
love both. We love all three

645
00:59:17.199 --> 00:59:21.960
of these episodes this week, but
there can only be one victor because of

646
00:59:22.000 --> 00:59:25.320
course, Aspen, what do we
say, Art is a binary? Art

647
00:59:25.440 --> 00:59:29.880
is a binary and Star Wars is
better than Star Trek. Well, Star

648
00:59:29.920 --> 00:59:32.039
Trek is better than Star Wars,
and so let's answer the question once overall,

649
00:59:32.719 --> 00:59:36.480
which is better this week? Star
Trek versus Star Wars? Once again?

650
00:59:36.519 --> 00:59:43.119
The episodes are a journey to Babel
versus Gone with the Mimphs and the

651
00:59:43.159 --> 00:59:49.000
first Apprentice who went last time asmen, I'm gonna ask you for your ranking

652
00:59:49.119 --> 00:59:52.760
first, starting with Gone with the
Memphs and the First Apprentice. I'm gonna

653
00:59:52.760 --> 00:59:59.000
give him a seven point seven seven
point Wow, that's pretty robust, aspen

654
00:59:59.519 --> 01:00:01.760
you think so? Is that too
robust? I don't know. Nothing is

655
01:00:01.840 --> 01:00:06.519
real anymore. Nothing is real.
Ranking is like completely arbitrary, and it's

656
01:00:06.599 --> 01:00:10.320
just a numerical value that you're placing
on a piece of art within the moment.

657
01:00:10.480 --> 01:00:14.880
Although I will say that it's higher
than the last episodes's Night of the

658
01:00:14.920 --> 01:00:17.639
Stranger. Oh, that was a
really good episode. Yeah, but you

659
01:00:17.800 --> 01:00:21.679
liked us better. I'm playing with
it, but I really did like these

660
01:00:21.719 --> 01:00:24.800
episodes. Yeah, they're great.
Yeah, I'm gonna I'm gonna stick with

661
01:00:24.840 --> 01:00:32.039
it because what nothing is real?
Nothing is real. I'm gonna I'm also

662
01:00:32.079 --> 01:00:36.159
gonna put a seven. Nice.
No, I'm gonna do a six point

663
01:00:36.159 --> 01:00:39.400
eight. Oh because a because I'm
in charge of the spreadsheet, so I

664
01:00:39.400 --> 01:00:44.920
could adjust it now. Yeah.
Uh, and the I did find my

665
01:00:44.960 --> 01:00:52.719
attention to wandering just a little bit. But still strong apps, strong conflicts,

666
01:00:52.199 --> 01:00:57.679
that's it, that's it. Hot
apps, Hot apps. Yeah,

667
01:00:58.320 --> 01:01:01.239
journey to Bable though, what are
we rank this legend? Eight point five

668
01:01:01.320 --> 01:01:08.840
eight point five any particular reason.
I fucking loved it. I think really

669
01:01:08.840 --> 01:01:14.840
strong, a lot of great shit. I will say I'm docking it slightly

670
01:01:15.320 --> 01:01:16.679
for the fact that it was there's
a lot of plot. I know.

671
01:01:16.800 --> 01:01:20.639
I said that I think it all
worked really well, and it did,

672
01:01:21.199 --> 01:01:25.280
but there were a couple of moments
where I was just like, what's going

673
01:01:25.320 --> 01:01:36.000
on? But still fabulous, always
always uh centered on humanity and humor and

674
01:01:36.039 --> 01:01:42.639
relationship. Also ends with h McCoy
almost looking right down the barrel of the

675
01:01:42.679 --> 01:01:46.000
camera almost and being like, is
I finally get the last word? Which,

676
01:01:47.000 --> 01:01:50.440
honestly, it could have been like
down to a five, and that

677
01:01:50.440 --> 01:01:53.480
would have pulled it up to an
eight point five. So that's why we're

678
01:01:53.599 --> 01:02:01.039
gonna rank this in nine point one. This is an incredible episode. I

679
01:02:01.039 --> 01:02:05.360
mean, aside from the fact that
it's a great episode of Star Trek,

680
01:02:06.159 --> 01:02:10.599
just looking at this mechanically from a
stream writing perspective, I don't understand how

681
01:02:10.679 --> 01:02:15.880
all of this feels so cohesive.
Yet it does. And just like you

682
01:02:15.920 --> 01:02:19.280
said, it all feeds into one
another. It should feel disjointed, but

683
01:02:19.559 --> 01:02:25.639
it all really dovetails into each other
really nicely in an economical wing. Because

684
01:02:25.679 --> 01:02:30.639
again, all of this takes place
on the USS Enterprise on all pre existing

685
01:02:30.719 --> 01:02:39.559
sets. It's it's extraordinary, strong
drama, strong character work, and McCoy

686
01:02:39.599 --> 01:02:44.320
gets the last word. That's great. That's good, that's great. That

687
01:02:44.480 --> 01:02:50.239
means that gone with the Memsen.
The First Apprentice has a paltry seven point

688
01:02:50.280 --> 01:02:59.280
two five this week combined average versus
Your Journey to Babels robust strong eight point

689
01:02:59.400 --> 01:03:04.360
eight, just busting out of its
button down shirt, these muscles rippling out

690
01:03:04.480 --> 01:03:10.119
good grief. I means that means
that Star Trek wins the week, and

691
01:03:10.320 --> 01:03:15.360
I for one, and please just
Podjaspin, I'm okay with that. I

692
01:03:15.440 --> 01:03:20.880
am. I mean, I still
think overall, I have to stick to

693
01:03:21.199 --> 01:03:24.800
my bit. But if fucking love
this, I just love Star Trek,

694
01:03:24.920 --> 01:03:29.800
let's be real. Yeah, and
I love Star Wars, which is and

695
01:03:30.280 --> 01:03:35.000
you know who else we love asmen
me well, yeah, of course,

696
01:03:35.000 --> 01:03:38.000
but I was gonna say more directly
our listeners, Okay, listening to this

697
01:03:38.159 --> 01:03:44.920
podcast. Thank you so much for
listening. If you love this podcast so

698
01:03:45.159 --> 01:03:47.199
much and just want to help us
out a little bit, why not leave

699
01:03:47.239 --> 01:03:52.639
a review trek warspod dot com click
on the reviews tab. We've made it

700
01:03:52.760 --> 01:03:57.119
very easy, and just leave a
review either on the website or go to

701
01:03:57.159 --> 01:04:00.800
the podcast over your choice. Hopefully
leave us a five star review. We

702
01:04:00.960 --> 01:04:04.840
love to hear feedback, like on
our social media channels. Follow us on

703
01:04:04.880 --> 01:04:10.880
blue Sky or Instagram on also I
guess Twitter, at track Wars Pod or

704
01:04:10.920 --> 01:04:16.400
blue Sky just crossed one hundred followers. Pretty proud of that. And then

705
01:04:16.679 --> 01:04:20.199
also, if you don't want to
use social media, we understand, send

706
01:04:20.280 --> 01:04:25.679
us an email trek Wars Pod at
gmail dot com. Finally, if you

707
01:04:25.760 --> 01:04:29.079
want to help us keep the lights
on, hop over to our Patreon Patreon

708
01:04:29.119 --> 01:04:32.960
dot com slash track Wars Pod.
You can help us pay the bills with

709
01:04:33.000 --> 01:04:38.840
your five dollars a month pledge and
in return we give you extended episodes.

710
01:04:38.880 --> 01:04:44.039
This week we talked about Ghostbusters,
Frozen, Empire, Oh Bur So Cold,

711
01:04:44.119 --> 01:04:48.519
and also did James a Cast impressions
for a while. So again Patreon

712
01:04:48.559 --> 01:04:54.519
dot com Slushtrack Wars Pod, and
you too could join the five bulous auspices

713
01:04:54.519 --> 01:04:58.599
of folks like Timpa De Sosa and
Olie Brice, Love Honey Rogers, Kevin

714
01:04:58.599 --> 01:05:00.679
Miller, Mark Webber. We love
you, buddy, We know you're going

715
01:05:00.679 --> 01:05:04.039
through a hard Time, you love
the heck out of you, Ryan Hill.

716
01:05:06.000 --> 01:05:13.239
And finally, the writer of the
fabulous I starship song Jaulty Partner,

717
01:05:13.320 --> 01:05:15.679
thank you. Oh while I'm at
it, freaking shout out to the person

718
01:05:15.679 --> 01:05:24.000
who wrote our theme song, please
go visit his work in the show notes.

719
01:05:24.079 --> 01:05:27.000
Check out the show notes and tap
on that link that's in there.

720
01:05:27.679 --> 01:05:30.159
And he missed us. I didn't
mention that Joel and I got into a

721
01:05:30.199 --> 01:05:39.000
heated argument during Journey the Babel.
I was trying to just really quick because

722
01:05:39.000 --> 01:05:43.079
you mentioned them and I love him. Sorry, this is important, It

723
01:05:43.159 --> 01:05:48.519
is important final content. I was
trying to argue that, so this podcast

724
01:05:48.559 --> 01:05:54.920
is choose between taking over now that
Kirk is injured versus like helping his father

725
01:05:55.159 --> 01:06:00.199
by giving him a transfusion. And
I was like, I I think that

726
01:06:00.559 --> 01:06:05.480
Scottie could handle this. Yes,
absolutely, one thousand percent. Thank you.

727
01:06:06.920 --> 01:06:13.400
The spot is being purposely obtubes.
It's using duty as duty as a

728
01:06:13.480 --> 01:06:16.199
means to escape. That's what I
said. But I think Spock is so

729
01:06:16.320 --> 01:06:20.239
repressed that he doesn't even realize that. And I say this because I feel

730
01:06:20.280 --> 01:06:25.360
that in my bones, I feel
that I have done not necessarily that exact

731
01:06:25.440 --> 01:06:29.360
same things, but I feel like
I have used duty as an excuse to

732
01:06:29.440 --> 01:06:34.159
get out of really important things.
Justified Okay, that's great, thank you,

733
01:06:34.480 --> 01:06:41.320
Trek. Sorry, validated, vindicated. I am selfish, I am

734
01:06:41.320 --> 01:06:47.320
wrong, right, I swear I'm
right. Oh. Speaking of dashboard confessionals,

735
01:06:47.320 --> 01:06:50.320
I have one more confession, Aspen. Okay, okay, I love

736
01:06:50.360 --> 01:06:56.119
you. I love you too.
Listeners, we love you. Uh.

737
01:06:56.320 --> 01:07:00.599
May the Force be with you and
live long and prosper Also with you,

738
01:07:00.440 --> 01:07:16.480
Pepi beer m