REPOST: The Intergalactic Podcast - Star Wars: The Last Jedi

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Hey, it's Mike. Welcome to
Intergalactic, the podcast about the greatest sci

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fi movies and TV of all time. Today, we're having a conversation about

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twenty seventeen's The Last Jedi, the
eighth, Star Wars, Skywalker Saga movie

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tent depends. Yeah, intense theatrically
released. Okay, but in US only

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if we're counting internationally, twelfth theatrically
released Star Wars. Because the u Woks

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movies were released theatrically in Europe.
Listen, you should have seen them,

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should you have Walks movies? I
saw them when I was a child in

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the in the theater. Internationally,
Well, it was on the border.

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It was in Brownsville, Texas,
so it's right next to Mexico, so

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literally like half a mile away from
the border. So well, oh yeah,

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so you saw Star Wars the way
that it was meant to be seen

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in in chronological release order, on
the border, on the border, on

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the border. Yeah, yeah,
yeah, that's right. Yeah, that's

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really cool. It's cool. Yeah, I think so, because I mean,

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we had to learn how to like
those movies. Some of us liked

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it much better than others. I
still think, yeah, I still think

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battlefoor indoor is great. It's it's
better. It's better, it's better.

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It's a challenge. It's good.
It's gotta way. It's on the plus

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right. The Disney plum is yeah, okay, I'll watch it one day.

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There's a witch in it, Yes, I remember the witch. I

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remember two little blonde babies being in
it with curly hair, mostly in the

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first one. Is that the first? Because we've got Mace and Sindel Wind.

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I cannot believe. I cannot believe
that I remembered the names of the

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two little two little towrps from Caravan
of Courage and Ewalk Adventure. Wicked was

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also a little twitch. Yeah,
not blonde. I like Wicked. I

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like anyway. Last Jedi. It's
a movie that I love because it's super

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compelling, challenging, weird, sexy, all those things. Here to chat

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about it with me are the co
hosts of the trek Wars podcast. Kenny

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Madison, Hi, Kenny, Hello, Aspin Webster, Hi ass Spin Hi,

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we high fived. Very good.
Do it on the mic, though,

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like in front of one of the
mics. There you go, just

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in case we didn't get it,
Just in case, I'll fully it in

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two more research. So I'm a
furious note taker. So you're in front

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of me, but I'll be looking
on my computer and you it's gonna a

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little weird. So, Kenny,
Like I always do with guests on this

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podcast, I send them a link
to a list of like two hundred of

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my favorite sci fi movies, and
I say, pick some to talk about

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with me on the podcast. This
is one of the first ones you picked.

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Yes, why'd you want to talk
about the last Jedi TLJ as TLJ

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as gen Xers call it. Yeah, I am an honorary gen x or

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uh, probably because I have the
pop culture taste of a gen x Er.

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Maybe straight up baby boomer. Actually, yeah, how do gen Xers

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make hand hearts? Yeah? Is
this the first half of a joke that

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has a punchline? No, I
just learned today that anyway. Gen z

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Ers do handharts differently. Please go
to hand heart like that, but they

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do it like this. Oh,
yes, this is an audio for I

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did it the gen X one with
fingers gen Z. This is gen Z

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your gen Z. Oh, I'm
gen Z. I did it with fingers

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only? Is gen Z gen x
is the whole hand? Yeah? The

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millennials whole hands. And this is
one of the reasons I like this,

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right, This is one of the
reasons why I like The Last Jedi because

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it's taking something that you know and
blowing it up, pushing it forward and

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challenging, challenging what makes the source
material the source material. I remember whenever

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I finally clicked with Last Jedi,
because it was an extremely rivening experience to

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walk out of that movie and very
rarely am I just like, I don't

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know if I like that the same, I the same. Well, it's

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not that okay, Sorry, I
don't want to no, I mean as

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but we're probably gonna have very similar
opinions Aspen, which is nice. Yeah,

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this is a podcast where I talk
about movies I like and love,

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so bring it. Yes, it
was a very challenging watch. And then

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I think I watched it again that
weekend because it's a Star Wars movie,

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and at some point it clicked for
me and I was like, oh,

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wow, this is really ambitious.
Uh, it isn't It isn't perfect,

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but gosh darn it. More than
so much Star Wars, which so much

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of the stuff plays it so safe, Last Jedi is really attempting to say

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something about uh. Whereas Empire Strikes
Back was kind of a deconstruction of Jesseph

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Campbell's monol myth in The Hero's Journey. Last Jedi, Shut Up. Last

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Jedi was a deconstruction of Star Wars
what makes Star Wars star Wars, challenging

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our notions of heroism, challenging our
notions of individualism, and then also bothering

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to actually ask an answer the question
why continued this story, Whereas Force Awakens

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was a fun, fluffy ray tread
of so much it didn't bother to ask

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the question so much as just give
us more Star Wars and then Rogue one,

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which I don't know if you know
this money that's a war movie.

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Really, it's really like people die
like people. It's actually this is a

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pretty original thuck. But he dies
in that movie, right, But it's

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different because like it's the it's the
first Star Wars movie, which is like

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a warm but then the Last Jedi
is just like why why? Why more

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Star Wars? And the answer and
we finally get an answer, which is

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we keep existing in these power loops. Yes, and finally addressing these circular

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notions of George Lucas's famous. It's
like poetry at rhyme. It's making that

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textual. Yeah, there's there's just
so much thematic meat and theme is what

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excites me most whenever I go watch
a movie. More than visuals, maybe

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more than dialogue, is just thematic
meat. Love it. Yeah, it

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must been. Tell me about your
thoughts on this movie. I can see

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you're itching too. No, sorry, no, I'm I'm a vegetarian,

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so I don't like meat. No, no meat. There's a lot of

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protein on the book. Yeah,
that's protein. There's a lot of protein

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within the pack. Yeah, a
lot of a lot of tofu last night.

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Yes, but you're worrying of Star
Wars T shirt today. You're the

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Star Wars contingent of Trek Wars,
which is a podcast that asked the question

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what's better Star Trek or Star Wars. Of course it's at It's about a

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lot more than that, It's true, but that's the that's the pitch,

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right, So tell me about your
thoughts on Last Jedi. They're very similar.

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I also had a very I had
I remember the exact experience of seeing

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that film. It was very late
at night. It wasn't a midnight showing.

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I remember it was the only one
I could get opening weekend. It

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was opening weekend. I waited a
little too long. It was the only

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one I could get, and I
remembered feeling distinctly uncomfortable, like my stomach

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felt weird. It's so uncomfortable.
Yeah, And I was like, that's

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not how Star Wars makes me feel. Star Wars is just as a sensation,

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a hope or something or kind of
an experience. And I did the

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same thing where I then watched it
again and I realized what was happening was

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on a kind of parallel processing.
I was being faced with the idea of

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what is it to fail and the
discomfort of failure and what that looks like

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and maybe how to you know to
know? And that's a huge theme that

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is the thematic meat of the film
is failure as a teacher and to move

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beyond, to move beyond these expectations
or the past, and to deconstruct and

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to have that real sensation and kind
of sit with that for what does that

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mean for me as a person who, like a lot of people, it

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really struggles with failure and perfectionism.
And then you have something on screen saying

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what if we did. And also
this is inherent too rebellion. Oh so

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after that point I was all in
and as many times as I saw it,

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every single time I would But even
then, I just rewatched it last

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night for this You're welcome, You're
welcome, thank you, thank you,

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and I had that exact same experience
again, like I was like, oh

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God, because of the actions that
Poe was taking in his desire to be

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the hero, an individual hero,
when instead it's not about individual heroes,

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it's about collective action. His desire
to be that individual hero is what ultimately

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gets so many people killed. And
that's a horrifying feeling, a horrifying thought.

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And also the movie, for the
one of the most uncomfortable parts of

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it is that it forces you to
sit in that feeling in a very visceral

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way, as opposed to I mean, there have been so many other pieces

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of art that have said this is
what failure feels like. Yeah, what

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is great about Last Jedi is that
it's so very uncomfortable in doing that in

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a way that is really challenging.
Your notions of individualism doesn't work all the

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time in the context of the most
popular PUPU should them up franchise in the

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world. Yes, that people were
not prepared to sit with those feelings when

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they bought their ticket and said in
the theater, no, it's that movie.

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This movie is a especially considering where
Star Wars has gone since then,

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it's it's become such an anomaly.
Unfortunately. How how much do you guys

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engage or read or let bother you
the the negative reactions to this movie or

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really just the negative reactions or the
anti woke people who scream at things like

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this. I do enjoy engaging with
good faith criticism it because the movie is

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not a perfect, perfect movie,
Like it even doesn't like I was even

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just thinking. It does these things
and it makes you feel uncomfortable, and

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then it does immediately alleviate your discomfort
by having hold O say something like I

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like him, and it's like,
no, post should probably go on trial,

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you know, So there are not
It's not a perfect film, So

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I'm with you. Yeah, A
lot of that is just beholding to the

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franchise, like this guy is going
to be the next movie. We got

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to root for him somehow, Yeah, because you can't. Yes, and

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with Star Wars, because it is
just a nearly religious text for so many

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people on there, you can't do
anything that is challenging pre existing notions,

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which is why one of the things
that I love to say so much is,

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let's reapproach this thing again in ten
or twenty years. See what the

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heck people are saying, because it
takes that long for folks to get used

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to it. Just look at the
narrative of the prequels, which one of

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the things that I love so much
about asking is that you found your way

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to Star Wars through episode one,
which I don't think I've met anyone who

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is just like, my first piece
of Star Wars was Episode one and I

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loved it. I've met those people
and they're nineteen years old. Well I

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was nine years old. I okay, So that was my first and then

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my story I like to tell is
I saw it. I saw it with

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my dad, which was very important, loved it, lost my mind,

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and then immediately was like, made
a blockbuster, Get me the via do

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it, get me those VHS tapes. Although I guess we did engage in

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toxic fandom recently in the Imperial March
Madness brand, I will so what is

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this? Oh my god, Well, before we get to this can I

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just say, Can I just say
again? As I was watching this last

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night, I did have a moment
or real anger moment. I said,

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it's my poor partner. I was
just like, I have to my poor

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partner, my partners, this is
a bit he loves he loves them,

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I do, Angel loves you.
Joel's not a big fan of this movie,

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so I'm not really we're not really
allowed to talk about it with each

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other, and but I did say, I was like, I have to

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do. I have to say one
thing. I'm gonna tell you. I

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hate that I'm watching this film.
And when I could just be saying I

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love this movie. This is a
movie that means so much to me.

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I'm having a great time. It
doesn't have to be perfect, and instead

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I'm having to think, well,
how could I defend this moment? How

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could I defend this moment? And
that's what I hate more than anything,

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Like I'm like, get away from
me. Like the bad faith criticism again,

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good faith criticism is fine, I
want to do that love. I

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actually love good faith criticism, love
it because it can enriched freaking Yeah.

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Our episode that we recorded, yes, not yesterday, but the day before,

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Bread and circuses. Oh yeah,
where you were a lot cooler on

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that episode for justifiable reasons, and
it's just really fun to be like,

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yeah, I absolutely agree, or
I guess Matrix's directions, which is a

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bona FID map based non is,
I will be right. I would like

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to engage in some good faith criticism
on that movie with you one day,

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in the sense that it's so good
and you're just like, I need to

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take a lap TVD. To Kenny's
credit, he once was like, why

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don't you like it? And then
I gave him actual, real reasons and

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stuff I don't like it, and
then he was like, that's really fair,

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and I was like like that,
yeah, because boring though I know,

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yeah, yes, And did I
interrupt your thought? No? At

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yeah, I'm curious, but we
just engaged with toxic fandom. I helped

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create a bracket for our friends over
at the podcast to hold the maneuver,

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and through the March month of March
they did an Imperial March Madness bracket of

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all Star Wars films and Spaceballs and
a lot of Star Wars TV shows and

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Spaceball's the TV show. Yes,
and I thought one of the fun matchups

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would be in Round one was the
last Jedi versus the Holiday Special, because

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I knew, Mike, have you
seen an Holiday Special? Yeah? Oh

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yeah, that was that was a
thing I did. I find the Holiday

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Special. I can't watch it all
at in one city. Now. It

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is. It is an intolerable experience. And there's there's nothing that I can

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say. There is nothing that anyone
can say because everyone thinks it's going to

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be so bad. It's good whenever
you haven't seen it, and then when

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you haven't seen it, you're like, no, this is just this is

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just bad. It's not a fun
experience for anyone. You watched it the

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first time, and I was in
the room when it happened, the room

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when it happened, the room when
it happened. Yeah, and you were

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having a visceral reaction. Yeah,
I was. I was squirming. I

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kept yelling things. I kept saying
no, Hi, Yes, it's so

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weird because they made that when there
was nothing else. It was just the

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first movie, right, Yeah,
And they're like, how do we extend

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this? How do we keep people
feeling excited for the next film? Before

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because no one understood Star Wars It's
story. It was product and yeah,

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it was literally designed it was.
It was a weird battle of Hollywood people

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and variety television show writers and a
mess effectively in the end, with no

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clear vision like it was not overseen, of course by any means by Lucas,

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because everyone was also kind of looking
down at Star Wars at the same

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time. Right, yeah, two, put this on a bracket, yes,

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yes, bad. Let's just make
this clear to anyone who doesn't know.

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This is not a fun this is
not a fun to watch. Bad.

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Yeah, just to contextualize. Because
I knew that we ask someone to

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vote on the Last Jedi, it's
going to invite vitriol, And so I

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thought a fun pairing would be Holiday
Special and Last Jedi to force people to

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choose. And Holiday Special won that
bracket handily. Fuck that, and not

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only that, Folks were like,
at least Holiday Special didn't betray Luke skywat

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character. And I'm like, my
but course, right, have you seen

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Holiday Special? Star Wars fundamentally betrays
itself from the beginning. The answer is

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they haven't seen Holiday Special. No, and a lot of people haven't,

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but they just hate the Last Jedi. It as an opportunity to hate on

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the last Jedi yesh I rarely engage
with toxic fandom. I pretend it's not

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there a lot, you know.
I just like what I like, right,

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I have a good time. But
sometimes I don't know if I have

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too much protein in the morning,
or I you know, beef, you

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have meat, or I did drink
a really big coffee this morning, so

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maybe I got amped up and I
was looking at the Facebook. Yeah,

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and this wasn't about last Jedi,
but it was about something similar. It

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was about the X Men, and
I decided, oh, I don't like

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this, so I am going to
engage with it. But it kind of

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like it reminded me of the times
I have looked at her engaged with talks

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of fandom about the last Jedi.
So I'm enjoying X Men ninety seven.

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It's a good time. It is
so much fun. Yeah, it's fun.

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And I like they're doing something interesting
with Storm's character where they they took

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away her powers for her to go
to this great emotional story spoilers, I'm

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sorry, where eventually she'll learn how
to get her powers back and be a

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stronger person, and also engaging her
in this interesting love story which is deepening

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the character more than it's ever been
on screen. It's interesting and compelling.

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It was a thread on Facebook where
someone's like, I'm canceling my Disney subscription

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because of what they've done to Storm
on X Men ninety seven? What and

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have they never seen a comic book
before where they understand that the status quo

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is going to be reset? And
I had to respond, I don't usually

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respond or look at these things.
Today I was just like, you mean,

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give her an unexpected emotional storyline with
the potential to explore the character with

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more death on screen than ever before
and celebrate her strength with and without powers,

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while also paying omash to the character's
heritage in a dignified way and putting

250
00:18:33.799 --> 00:18:37.839
her at the center of a complex
and compelling multicultural love story. Yeah that's

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so bad. Haha, fuck you. We're like, I don't know.

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Is that why? I don't know? No responses, and then the rest

253
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of the threads just like why is
this woke? Anyway? I had to

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disengage, like you, I hate
black people in Women nine are got it?

255
00:19:00.359 --> 00:19:03.000
Got it? Thank you for telling
me, And it's just reminded me

256
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of like what I read about the
Last Jedi. Would I continue to read

257
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about the Last Jedi when people are
bitching about Luke Skywalker. They made him

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such an interesting character. They did
all these great thematic themes here by breaking

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the character down and then giving him
this wonderful arc and growing the character so

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much. I got to tell you
about my experience with this movie. I

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enjoy most Star Wars movies. Is
there I want to come back to this,

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but I just, oh, let's
do it. I need to talk

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about this is the coolest that Luke
Skywalker has ever been. Listen when he

264
00:19:37.200 --> 00:19:41.680
gives three bo the wink, that's
the coolest moments ever. Listen to me.

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00:19:41.839 --> 00:19:47.079
He gets a because he lives on
cliffs. What's the most badass place

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00:19:47.119 --> 00:19:49.599
that you can live cliffs? He
just lives on cliffs in a hunt a

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hut that he made. He broke
his uh spaceship and made a door.

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Pretty cool. But the lizard nuns
not lizard the fish nuns help and so

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and so what does he do to
get around big stick? And so he

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just pull vaults literally everywhere on his
cliffs that he lives in. And then

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within five minutes of beating Last Jedi
Luke Skywalker, he stabs a fish.

272
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Yes, grabs it, milks a
cow and it's like, m that's good.

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And then is walking in the rain, his robes soaked. It's so

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cool, Luke s kyo. And
also the beard, he's grizzled, he's

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haggard. And then also the ultimate
cool thing, which is I don't want

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to do any of the Star Wars
stuff. Yeah, that's cool, you

277
00:20:40.319 --> 00:20:41.640
know, it's very cool for a
person like me. He's like, fuck

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00:20:41.680 --> 00:20:45.759
the Jedi, and I'm like,
that's what I said. It's true for

279
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years. I'm like, they're the
ones that let it happen because of their

280
00:20:48.599 --> 00:20:51.000
own complacency. They're the ones that
like, fucked up. Thank you for

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00:20:51.119 --> 00:20:52.839
actively saying the thing out loud?
Can I swear? Okay? Yes?

282
00:20:52.880 --> 00:20:57.480
Please? And he calls it a
laser sword. It's like that's what they

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call it at CVS when they try
to sell you, you know, and

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praise a sort at home. It
was like I went to Spirit Spirit Halloween.

285
00:21:06.079 --> 00:21:08.559
And also any any ire that you
need to throw it at, Luke

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00:21:08.599 --> 00:21:15.119
Skywalker has to be thrown at uh
JJ uncasionally well, and because it's like

287
00:21:15.240 --> 00:21:18.680
where else could it have gone?
If you say that this great hero abandoned

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00:21:18.720 --> 00:21:22.519
literally everyone and is no longer there. The only logical place to go is,

289
00:21:22.599 --> 00:21:26.119
well, that's a person like,
what's he gonna do. She's Ray's

290
00:21:26.119 --> 00:21:26.559
gonna show up and he's gonna be
like, oh my god, you were

291
00:21:26.640 --> 00:21:30.720
right. Sorry, let me come
back like what I think it goes to

292
00:21:30.759 --> 00:21:33.400
that first thing, and I want
to come back to your last Jedi experience.

293
00:21:33.519 --> 00:21:38.599
Mike uh As, the host of
this podcast, My god, thank

294
00:21:38.640 --> 00:21:42.200
you so much for having Thank you
so much for what if I interrupted you?

295
00:21:44.880 --> 00:21:47.319
But I think so much of a
fundamental sports for me, right,

296
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we love to talk comes comes down
to that real hard tonal acceptance of Luke,

297
00:21:52.680 --> 00:21:57.119
like throwing that lightsaber behind his shoulder. But then also that sense of

298
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humor is all over or force awakens. It's so funny. Yeah, it

299
00:22:02.920 --> 00:22:07.519
is so funny from beginning to end. I start out laughing with this movie,

300
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not at it, but with it
because there's kind of a yo,

301
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mama joke at the beginning, which
is great. And then when it's the

302
00:22:14.640 --> 00:22:18.480
exact same sense of humor that Poe
had forced awakens because he's like, who

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00:22:18.480 --> 00:22:22.079
talks first? I talked first?
Yeah, first, It's it's the same

304
00:22:22.519 --> 00:22:26.359
sense of humor. Yeah, like
when you said this maybe is sexy.

305
00:22:26.920 --> 00:22:32.599
Did you mean did you mean the
cow milking? I mean, I'll admit

306
00:22:32.680 --> 00:22:34.279
that. Sure. You told your
wife you were just gonna be like,

307
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I'm gonna take ten minutes in the
bathroom real quick. I'm like, I

308
00:22:37.079 --> 00:22:47.720
like this milking scene, honey,
order a table and the circular saw.

309
00:22:45.519 --> 00:22:56.599
Sorry, I've seen those videos.
Man, Oh god, what was question?

310
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What was your last time? Yoh, he's your last Jedi experience on

311
00:23:00.559 --> 00:23:07.440
your podcast. I love all these
movies. It was an extremely emotional experience.

312
00:23:07.559 --> 00:23:11.519
I was beyond entertained. I was
moved. I was surprised it wasn't

313
00:23:11.559 --> 00:23:15.799
opening weekend, but it was like
Christmas weekend. Whenever a Star Wars movie

314
00:23:15.799 --> 00:23:19.039
comes out, we go watch it
in Christmas if it's around that time.

315
00:23:19.599 --> 00:23:26.519
So the movie had me in its
grip so many times, and I teared

316
00:23:26.599 --> 00:23:30.839
up a number of times during the
movie for the first watch, partly because

317
00:23:30.839 --> 00:23:37.200
of nostalgia, but also because of
genuine emotional storytelling from a franchise movie that

318
00:23:37.440 --> 00:23:42.599
took me on a deeply unexpected journey, like something I never thought Star Wars

319
00:23:42.640 --> 00:23:47.759
was really capable of doing anymore.
I didn't expect to be moved. I

320
00:23:47.759 --> 00:23:52.359
didn't expect to be challenged or surprised
or jostled by this movie, and it

321
00:23:52.400 --> 00:23:55.720
was such a fun experience. I'm
like, yes, throw more stuff at

322
00:23:55.720 --> 00:23:59.039
me that I don't see coming through, more stuff at me that I might

323
00:23:59.279 --> 00:24:03.920
have to that might challenge me,
right, And I loved it and it

324
00:24:03.960 --> 00:24:07.599
was so entertaining. Yeah, it's
not a perfect movie. There's some ship

325
00:24:07.640 --> 00:24:11.279
where I'm like, that's not good, but most of it it's amazing.

326
00:24:11.480 --> 00:24:15.240
I also, i gotta tell you, watching last night, I haven't seen

327
00:24:15.279 --> 00:24:17.160
it in a while, and by
a while, I'm in a year.

328
00:24:18.440 --> 00:24:22.799
I cried multiple times, just like
so one of the cry scenes for you,

329
00:24:23.359 --> 00:24:26.279
whenever the Star Wars logo appears,
Yeah right, Oh my god.

330
00:24:26.559 --> 00:24:32.079
I never thought the last time I
cried it the Star Wars logo was my

331
00:24:32.119 --> 00:24:37.160
first screening of the first prequel.
It was vandom, menace cried so when

332
00:24:37.160 --> 00:24:42.519
it came up, yeah, yeah, and then the movie started. I'm

333
00:24:42.519 --> 00:24:45.720
trying to think it was. It's
like I'm trying to think of exact moments.

334
00:24:45.759 --> 00:24:53.759
It was definitely throughout it. Anytime
anytime there's something about people being together

335
00:24:53.880 --> 00:25:00.279
on something like because ultimately, when
you were talking earlier about how Empire challenged

336
00:25:00.480 --> 00:25:04.640
the monoment the hero's journey. I
think this has to, like Last Jedi,

337
00:25:04.759 --> 00:25:08.640
is also as well as it can
fundamentally challenging the idea of what the

338
00:25:10.240 --> 00:25:12.680
fundamental idea of the hero's journey feel
free to correct me, is it's an

339
00:25:12.720 --> 00:25:18.240
individual fighting individuals that maybe that individual
is a part of a greater structure.

340
00:25:18.759 --> 00:25:22.880
And I do think this this movie
is doing the best it can to say.

341
00:25:22.079 --> 00:25:26.519
It can't it's literally not just one
of us. It cannot be.

342
00:25:26.079 --> 00:25:30.319
And in fact, there was like
this really then like saw this like this

343
00:25:30.480 --> 00:25:33.519
post what was it? I'm going
to find it so that because it reminded

344
00:25:33.519 --> 00:25:38.160
me exactly a bit, which was
like nope, I lost it, but

345
00:25:38.200 --> 00:25:41.920
it was it was I know so
much for that. But it was about

346
00:25:41.960 --> 00:25:48.839
like like connection and community is how
is our rebellion? Like that's what it

347
00:25:48.880 --> 00:25:52.039
is. And so every time there
was something about like it is us together

348
00:25:52.160 --> 00:25:56.799
as people who love each other so
deeply that we can be the thing.

349
00:25:56.240 --> 00:26:00.960
That's what felt so overwhelming for me
is like it's not anyone person, it

350
00:26:00.039 --> 00:26:04.519
is this and it's it's bleeding in
the thing. And that just gets me

351
00:26:04.799 --> 00:26:10.359
to know when so I love that
too. Yeah, I'm a big fan

352
00:26:10.640 --> 00:26:14.200
despite the weedon of it all.
A Buffy, right, Buffy the Vampire

353
00:26:14.240 --> 00:26:17.960
Slayer, And that's about the similar
thing power in a made family, a

354
00:26:18.000 --> 00:26:23.359
found family, a community. Right. And even though the I guess that

355
00:26:23.559 --> 00:26:30.759
show started out as centering on one
person with power, it quickly, quickly,

356
00:26:30.799 --> 00:26:33.880
even in the first episode, pivoted
to this is a story about found

357
00:26:33.920 --> 00:26:38.759
family and community and that's where the
real power comes from against all the negativity

358
00:26:38.759 --> 00:26:44.440
and evil they have to face,
right. And that's what this movie tried

359
00:26:44.480 --> 00:26:48.119
to turn Star Wars into for sure, when I think before it was also

360
00:26:48.200 --> 00:26:55.319
about that, but maybe it was
more of a savior narrative. I think

361
00:26:55.599 --> 00:27:00.920
you turned me onto this a return
of the Jedi being a out the collective

362
00:27:00.000 --> 00:27:08.319
victory through not not necessarily through text, but through craftsmanship, just literally through

363
00:27:08.559 --> 00:27:15.400
we are cross cutting, which the
structure, the structure is the thing,

364
00:27:15.519 --> 00:27:21.039
this collective victory. And then that
notion is taken from subtext to text,

365
00:27:21.480 --> 00:27:26.240
this time in the last Jedi,
which rips this movie is sexy, Yes,

366
00:27:26.319 --> 00:27:30.599
tell me more. It's again the
cow milk, Like, why do

367
00:27:30.640 --> 00:27:37.759
you think it's sexy? Why do
you think it's well there's there's a deepening

368
00:27:38.519 --> 00:27:45.680
connection story throughout this entire movie with
the lead Ray and Kyl Lorene, right

369
00:27:45.160 --> 00:27:52.799
yeah, and there's from beginning to
end there's this. There's even though it's

370
00:27:52.839 --> 00:27:56.119
explained why they can see each other
and touch each other through the forest or

371
00:27:56.119 --> 00:28:00.519
whatever. And it's like the bad
guy who looks like a bunch of voltmeal

372
00:28:00.559 --> 00:28:03.759
on his face or whatever his name
is, Snoke, yeah, whatever,

373
00:28:04.039 --> 00:28:08.519
the whole game and Andy Serkis performance
to end all circus performances. One of

374
00:28:08.519 --> 00:28:12.480
my favorite Andy Serkis performance is in
a Star Wars this one. Yeah,

375
00:28:12.519 --> 00:28:17.440
okay, yeah, it's good.
I like when you kill him it is

376
00:28:17.480 --> 00:28:22.839
great. But no, the sense
that there is a connection so strong between

377
00:28:22.839 --> 00:28:27.599
these people that they're mystically connected and
can you know, is FaceTime with each

378
00:28:27.640 --> 00:28:32.960
other whenever they want was It was
wonderful. I was surprised whenever people were

379
00:28:33.000 --> 00:28:34.400
like, how can they do this? And I was like, because they're

380
00:28:34.440 --> 00:28:37.960
doing the same phase as they did
at the Empire strikes Back, right,

381
00:28:38.079 --> 00:28:41.839
like this is fundamentally part of it. Like also these are they have laser

382
00:28:41.880 --> 00:28:45.640
swords? Does let it happen?
Yeah? Exactly? Oh yeah. Also

383
00:28:45.680 --> 00:28:48.160
the force I'm with you by the
way, I think they are. Like,

384
00:28:48.519 --> 00:28:52.839
we have this thing on our podcast
where we it's called ice Starship it

385
00:28:52.920 --> 00:28:56.279
where we pick our favorite literal starships
and then also our favorite romantic ships.

386
00:28:56.319 --> 00:29:00.640
And I was like, man,
mine is like this is an this isn't

387
00:29:00.680 --> 00:29:04.359
a joke ship. I ship ray
Kylo Rent so hard. Yeah, I

388
00:29:04.680 --> 00:29:08.160
really didn't know. I did until
like the third act of this movie,

389
00:29:08.400 --> 00:29:18.319
and I was like, fucking geez. One of the cri scenes for me

390
00:29:18.880 --> 00:29:23.960
was when they both decide to work
together and fight the Imperial Guards or the

391
00:29:23.960 --> 00:29:27.640
Red Guards. Right when that started, I just chills, man chills,

392
00:29:27.680 --> 00:29:32.039
and and I don't like, I
lost control of my face and I just

393
00:29:32.039 --> 00:29:33.720
started tearing up, Like why am
I crying? Because this is so good.

394
00:29:34.000 --> 00:29:38.079
That's why I'm freaking Ryan Johnson.
Yes, it's so good at freaking

395
00:29:38.359 --> 00:29:45.960
framing that lightsaber flies across the room
and then reaches up from out a frame.

396
00:29:45.319 --> 00:29:49.759
Oh and of just getting back to
back and I'm pumping my fists just

397
00:29:49.759 --> 00:29:53.319
being like, what what is going
to happen? What is going to happen?

398
00:29:53.440 --> 00:29:57.000
And she puts her arm on his
thigh. That's hot. Yeah,

399
00:29:57.039 --> 00:30:02.599
It's it's like regency level hot.
Like it's like watching you know, a

400
00:30:02.680 --> 00:30:06.640
Jane Jane Austener reading Jane Austen.
It's like there's the point where there their

401
00:30:06.680 --> 00:30:11.359
hands touch across face and you're just
like, oh, touch, Yeah,

402
00:30:11.440 --> 00:30:15.880
that's yes, very much. And
it's and it's the reason it's not.

403
00:30:17.119 --> 00:30:22.160
It's not just that. The reason
it feels sexy is because it's too lost

404
00:30:22.720 --> 00:30:29.480
people who are looking for meaning and
clearly are two very powerful people who just

405
00:30:29.880 --> 00:30:33.119
want to save each other in their
own ways. I mean, Kyle Ritt.

406
00:30:33.160 --> 00:30:37.519
You know it's it's complicated, but
oh it feels deeply emotionally motivated.

407
00:30:37.799 --> 00:30:41.440
And it's not it's it's treating me
like I'm smart too. It's like,

408
00:30:41.480 --> 00:30:45.759
you know that these things are complicated, and I'm like it is. They're

409
00:30:45.799 --> 00:30:49.880
both very singular, isolated people.
When we meet them and they meet each

410
00:30:49.880 --> 00:30:53.799
other and even though they're at odds, they realize we're the same. Yeah,

411
00:30:53.839 --> 00:30:57.519
you know, we're the same.
And that you know that in itself

412
00:30:57.640 --> 00:31:03.039
is sexy and compelling, and the
movie, not only with the visuals,

413
00:31:03.079 --> 00:31:06.880
but with that theme, it just
makes you care about these characters and care

414
00:31:06.920 --> 00:31:11.640
about their relationship and it doesn't necessarily
end up where I want it to be

415
00:31:11.680 --> 00:31:15.359
at the end of this movie.
But it's also challenging and compelling. Yeah,

416
00:31:15.440 --> 00:31:17.519
I could have. I was actually
thinking. I was like I might.

417
00:31:18.039 --> 00:31:21.720
I don't know if I would.
I wouldn't have hated a like a

418
00:31:22.160 --> 00:31:26.160
more gray ray, you know,
like a more complex kind of like not

419
00:31:26.240 --> 00:31:30.920
dissent, but like a because I
think if part of what we're doing is

420
00:31:30.960 --> 00:31:34.400
deconstructing the idea of like Jedi as
good or other forces as bad, which

421
00:31:34.519 --> 00:31:38.039
is its own kind of origin problem, because what the heck is the first

422
00:31:38.160 --> 00:31:44.279
order? Right? Like we were
talking about this where in Star Wars the

423
00:31:44.319 --> 00:31:48.160
Empire is the United States, like
we're the baddies, like, and there

424
00:31:48.160 --> 00:31:51.920
can be a complex way of looking
at that, and that's text and say

425
00:31:51.920 --> 00:31:55.240
that he said that, he said
that we are, you know, and

426
00:31:53.920 --> 00:31:59.680
if the rebellion is model after the
Vietcong, then that makes the empire the

427
00:31:59.759 --> 00:32:05.200
United States? Who was the first
order in this And it's very it's more

428
00:32:05.279 --> 00:32:07.880
like it's about the aesthetics of the
thing because of the way it was set

429
00:32:07.960 --> 00:32:10.519
up in the preceding movie, so
it's less of it has more of a

430
00:32:10.559 --> 00:32:15.720
black and white Well, they're just
Nazis and Nazis are never right. It

431
00:32:15.839 --> 00:32:17.240
was just stuet we should punch them. But like, you know, but

432
00:32:17.480 --> 00:32:22.240
so you don't get as many of
the like well what does it mean to

433
00:32:22.319 --> 00:32:27.079
stop engaging? And like fascism here
you get more of a sort of aesthetics

434
00:32:27.119 --> 00:32:30.160
based So I think it made it
very hard for there to be any other

435
00:32:30.240 --> 00:32:32.079
choice for her other than I cannot
engage in this. But what if it

436
00:32:32.160 --> 00:32:36.279
had been a greater sort of perspective. It's not just the JETI or not

437
00:32:36.400 --> 00:32:39.039
JETI. It is about the It's
almost like Buffy is a great example of

438
00:32:39.079 --> 00:32:43.319
the idea of we've activated all the
Slayers by the end of season seven,

439
00:32:43.920 --> 00:32:46.599
and it's like, that's kind of
the idea is everyone why not give everyone

440
00:32:46.640 --> 00:32:52.160
a power? Which is so Yeah, I think it's a very it's very

441
00:32:52.160 --> 00:32:54.880
interesting, and it could have been
a little more interesting if they had had

442
00:32:54.920 --> 00:33:00.480
more ability to go outside of the
structure. So I think, yeah,

443
00:33:00.599 --> 00:33:02.480
that reminds me of one of the
things that came to mind the first time

444
00:33:02.519 --> 00:33:06.720
I watched this movie. Is like
I said to myself, I love the

445
00:33:06.799 --> 00:33:13.319
idea that they democratize the force.
Yes, everybody has it. Everybody has

446
00:33:13.359 --> 00:33:15.440
it. You can tap into it, and it's not just because you're a

447
00:33:15.480 --> 00:33:21.359
skywalker, or because you're a Kenobi, or because somebody was your grandpa or

448
00:33:21.400 --> 00:33:24.519
your dad and they had it.
I think that's a wonderful idea which speaks

449
00:33:24.559 --> 00:33:30.759
to the bigger theme of power by
community, right, Yes, power of

450
00:33:30.839 --> 00:33:32.880
community. Yes, it's it's not
about one individual person. And when I

451
00:33:32.920 --> 00:33:37.880
was I was like googling something and
one of the questions that shows up on

452
00:33:37.920 --> 00:33:39.799
Google was like, who is broom
Boy? And I'm like, who cares?

453
00:33:40.079 --> 00:33:45.559
Why? And that's because that's because
audiences have been trained everything is an

454
00:33:45.559 --> 00:33:52.000
easter egg, So so many clickbait
headlines of will the next movie be about

455
00:33:52.119 --> 00:33:57.079
broom Boy? Is broom boys Skywalker
care? He's a theme? Broom Boy

456
00:33:57.200 --> 00:34:00.440
is me? Boy is you?
Broom Boy is us playing with our Star

457
00:34:00.480 --> 00:34:10.760
Wars characters and feeling that this narrative
of someone who can save the universe inspires

458
00:34:10.840 --> 00:34:15.360
us to do great things. And
it's not just because you're special because you're

459
00:34:15.400 --> 00:34:16.800
from a bloodline. It's like we
can. We can all do it.

460
00:34:16.840 --> 00:34:22.920
And I think, especially in the
face of our own real potential descent into

461
00:34:22.960 --> 00:34:27.440
fascism, which is what the prequels
do have going for them. We've talked

462
00:34:27.480 --> 00:34:30.559
about this of like it is George
not so well, like at least trying

463
00:34:30.599 --> 00:34:36.039
to say that, look at how
fascism can arise from these systems like almost

464
00:34:36.079 --> 00:34:37.800
like like it's like, you know, to thunderous applause kind of the fall

465
00:34:37.880 --> 00:34:43.039
liberty, but it comes from these
banal ways of the origins. And as

466
00:34:43.039 --> 00:34:45.679
we face our own possible descent into
fascism, you know, it's not going

467
00:34:45.719 --> 00:34:51.559
to be one savior that comes up
and you know fixes it. It's it

468
00:34:51.639 --> 00:34:54.199
has to be connective action, right, And so that was another part me

469
00:34:54.280 --> 00:34:58.000
crying. I'm like, yeah,
brim Boy, is me me too?

470
00:34:58.239 --> 00:35:01.639
Yeah? Same, Yeah. I
I pictured myself as a kid being inspired

471
00:35:01.679 --> 00:35:06.760
by these movies and projected that onto
broom Boy for sure. Oh my god.

472
00:35:06.840 --> 00:35:08.199
Yeah. It was a definite crime
moment. It was like, sobbing,

473
00:35:08.719 --> 00:35:12.280
tell me about the Yoda of it
all. How do you guys feel

474
00:35:12.320 --> 00:35:15.079
about you pop my fist? Where
you talking about it? Very very positive?

475
00:35:15.079 --> 00:35:17.760
Puppa Yoda, he's cranky, he's
Empire Yoda, and it's a puppet.

476
00:35:17.760 --> 00:35:21.760
And I was just like, it's
a puppet. That's a puppet.

477
00:35:21.800 --> 00:35:24.599
It looks like that. And then
just realizing, oh, oh, this

478
00:35:24.760 --> 00:35:29.800
is a puppet. We have puppet
Yoda back. Not only have puppet Yoda

479
00:35:29.880 --> 00:35:31.960
back, we have not shitty Yoda. Yeah, and I don't have Yoda

480
00:35:32.039 --> 00:35:36.559
just laughing and having a good time
and calling Luke Skywalker a dickhead. Yes,

481
00:35:36.639 --> 00:35:38.519
I love it. He's not he's
not the Sage. Yeah, even

482
00:35:38.519 --> 00:35:43.519
though he is, but you know
that's he's not Sage first. He's like

483
00:35:43.960 --> 00:35:51.039
fucking around Yoda first. Yeah.
Yeah. It was so meaningful as opposed

484
00:35:51.079 --> 00:35:57.159
to Force Awakens, which it was
pilfering from iconography so clumsily. I feel

485
00:35:57.199 --> 00:36:01.639
like Last Jedi does it, and
so many emotionally meaningful ways that feel like

486
00:36:02.079 --> 00:36:06.880
it's true progressions. I mean,
whenever we see Yoda, that's Luke kind

487
00:36:06.880 --> 00:36:12.760
of deciding to actually tap into the
force at that point because he closed himself

488
00:36:12.800 --> 00:36:20.199
off and he's tapping his way back
in and that's it's it's extraordinary that scene.

489
00:36:20.239 --> 00:36:23.960
It's meaningful also a crime moment,
the sentence like we are what they

490
00:36:24.880 --> 00:36:30.159
grow beyond. It's great. Like
the that to me is like I think

491
00:36:30.280 --> 00:36:34.320
when I say I'm like I like
poo Yoda, I think it's actually a

492
00:36:34.400 --> 00:36:37.119
good thing that Yoda, the character
is annoying and frustrating because he is a

493
00:36:37.119 --> 00:36:39.679
problem and he and in my mind, I'm like, this is perfect.

494
00:36:39.760 --> 00:36:45.199
This is Yoda because Yoda from Empire
on is a different character than prequel Yoda.

495
00:36:45.280 --> 00:36:49.840
Who is this austere grumpasaur? Yeah? Yes, well, and he

496
00:36:50.079 --> 00:36:53.880
it's he knows it's partly his fault. Yeah, like this is it's his

497
00:36:53.960 --> 00:36:58.760
fault. It's it's there. It's
it's their actions or in action that lead

498
00:36:58.840 --> 00:37:00.639
to something. And I have to
just be like, well, ever since

499
00:37:00.679 --> 00:37:04.639
he became a Force ghost, he
must have been like, well, okay,

500
00:37:05.039 --> 00:37:07.440
let me think about failure a bit, let me think about what I

501
00:37:07.519 --> 00:37:12.800
can be. Yeah, it's a
real death gives you some pretty good hindsight

502
00:37:12.920 --> 00:37:17.159
in the Star Wars universe. I
love him. Yeah, yeah. Every

503
00:37:17.159 --> 00:37:29.039
time he comes on he does a
little you got a version of this that's

504
00:37:29.039 --> 00:37:37.400
more seth Rogan than I'm doing.
Yoda's in backlick making pottery. He is

505
00:37:36.360 --> 00:37:43.840
that. Do be with me?
Oh no, dumb money, don't watch

506
00:37:43.840 --> 00:37:49.719
it. That's okay, Uh tell
me about the because for me, I

507
00:37:49.760 --> 00:37:53.280
don't know, I'm dumb. So
I find it conflicting that Yoda summons a

508
00:37:53.360 --> 00:37:59.480
lightning bolt has fun. It seemingly
burns all the Jedi text and then Ray

509
00:37:59.679 --> 00:38:02.960
saved them at the end. Uh, I don't. My brain's too small

510
00:38:04.000 --> 00:38:07.000
to figure that out. What's what's
the movie saying that is? Michael?

511
00:38:07.119 --> 00:38:10.639
Is Mike swept for Michael? Yes, Michael, Michael, you know not

512
00:38:10.719 --> 00:38:14.880
them? Okay, Michael, You're
so smart. I see what you're doing.

513
00:38:14.880 --> 00:38:16.719
You're trying to be like, I'm
dumn Tell me, I'm sorry.

514
00:38:16.960 --> 00:38:22.480
I'm just I'm just a dumb little
milkmade over you umby. I just need

515
00:38:22.480 --> 00:38:35.159
to bend over pick up these nailpfuckets. Michael call me mikey Mike as in

516
00:38:35.280 --> 00:38:37.719
like it's kind of like, well
if we're if the implication here is who

517
00:38:37.760 --> 00:38:40.360
cares about the texts? Like we've
she doesn't need to read them. There's

518
00:38:40.360 --> 00:38:44.280
nothing in them that she doesn't already
have, right, but she does have

519
00:38:44.360 --> 00:38:50.880
them as they're sort of like an
inconsistency of message there. Yeah. I

520
00:38:50.920 --> 00:38:53.480
mean I can see you thinking,
is it one of those just we need

521
00:38:53.480 --> 00:38:58.320
these books in the next movie.
I could have Well, this is the

522
00:38:58.360 --> 00:39:01.239
first appearance by the way of books. Yea true and big books. They're

523
00:39:01.280 --> 00:39:06.199
like, we need to keep these
books for a good faith interpretation. I

524
00:39:06.239 --> 00:39:10.679
think Yoda's showing Luke that he needs
to let this go. He's too mired

525
00:39:10.800 --> 00:39:19.559
within what it should be as opposed
to what it is. And Ray is

526
00:39:19.679 --> 00:39:23.440
just starting her journey and so she
can the books are what it can be.

527
00:39:24.199 --> 00:39:31.639
She is not adhering to the strict
textual interpretation of what the Jedi and

528
00:39:31.679 --> 00:39:37.360
at large star Wars the thing that
it's really saying, Luke needs to let

529
00:39:37.400 --> 00:39:43.840
go of Star Wars and just be
here now what our expectations of what a

530
00:39:43.840 --> 00:39:46.800
Star Wars should be. And Ray
is just like, here's all the Star

531
00:39:46.880 --> 00:39:52.760
Wars that's there. I get to
start on this journey and then hopefully she

532
00:39:52.840 --> 00:39:57.440
can let go of it in a
way that Luke was unable to lose at

533
00:39:57.440 --> 00:40:00.559
the end. He's too mired because
he's like the mistakes of the the past,

534
00:40:00.599 --> 00:40:01.679
the past, the past, the
past, the past, the best

535
00:40:01.719 --> 00:40:06.119
die. Yeah, yeah, I'm
with you on that one. I think,

536
00:40:06.239 --> 00:40:09.280
you know, different people have different
ways that they might like interact with

537
00:40:09.480 --> 00:40:15.079
the philosophy of the thing. No, oh, okay, fuck me,

538
00:40:15.440 --> 00:40:21.280
yeah, yeah, I mean and
and her her journey is going to be

539
00:40:21.320 --> 00:40:23.760
different than his, so I think
that is a good faith kind of like

540
00:40:23.840 --> 00:40:29.760
interpretation of it to say she can
take from it what she needs and say

541
00:40:29.800 --> 00:40:37.000
no to some other things, whereas
Luke was admiring himself in an expectation which

542
00:40:37.039 --> 00:40:40.480
held him back. Yeah, raise
a very different type of person also that

543
00:40:40.599 --> 00:40:46.880
kind of expectation poison Kylo Wren,
Yes, yes, and then also poisons

544
00:40:46.920 --> 00:40:53.880
po and poisons a little bit of
Finn a little bit in terms of these

545
00:40:53.880 --> 00:40:58.320
are the things we have to Well, I'm thinking about this relation to Finn's

546
00:40:58.360 --> 00:41:02.639
art because everyone is reckoning with what
a Star Wars should be as opposed to

547
00:41:02.920 --> 00:41:07.400
we're trying to pull it into something
that's a little bit more relevant to twenty

548
00:41:07.440 --> 00:41:10.960
seventeen at the time, fent and
not to like get too far up,

549
00:41:12.000 --> 00:41:14.840
but I kept thinking about Finn,
and I was like, because I know

550
00:41:14.880 --> 00:41:17.760
that there's been a lot around and
John Boyega has correctly called out that it's

551
00:41:17.800 --> 00:41:21.239
like no one ever knew what to
do with me. They knew exactly what

552
00:41:21.360 --> 00:41:23.920
to do with Daisy and Adam,
like to do with like Ray and Kylo,

553
00:41:24.000 --> 00:41:28.800
but they didn't know what to do
with me. And my like protectiveness

554
00:41:28.800 --> 00:41:30.880
of last Jedi gets in laer.
I'm just like, well, yes,

555
00:41:30.920 --> 00:41:34.000
because you get screwed over and Rise
of Skywalker a movie that cannot inclyy doesn't

556
00:41:34.000 --> 00:41:38.280
exist. Yeah, what is that? The Rise of who knows? I'm

557
00:41:38.400 --> 00:41:44.239
song right, I mean the movie
about the let's find a map that gets

558
00:41:44.320 --> 00:41:46.320
us to the map that gets us
to the other map the video game.

559
00:41:47.719 --> 00:41:51.400
Yeah, which is also what Start
Your Discovery season five is doing. But

560
00:41:51.440 --> 00:41:54.119
that's for another chance. I'm fine
with that, Okay, I like it.

561
00:41:55.000 --> 00:41:58.119
It's fine. The map that gets
us to the map to the other

562
00:41:58.159 --> 00:42:01.519
map, that's a real map.
Oh that Look. The fault the Rise

563
00:42:01.559 --> 00:42:06.599
of Skywalker is not the fact that
it's about a mapuh. But uh,

564
00:42:07.119 --> 00:42:10.079
it's about a dagger that gets you
to the map. That's silly and stupid.

565
00:42:10.159 --> 00:42:15.159
But there's dumb plat mechanics in everything. Yeah. Uh, it's it's

566
00:42:15.159 --> 00:42:19.119
about the fact that that movie feels
to me so much of a coarse correction

567
00:42:19.480 --> 00:42:22.760
that is based off of every Reddit
complaint of Last Jedi that's as fault as

568
00:42:22.800 --> 00:42:27.119
opposed to Star Trek Discover, which
is just like, here's the thing that

569
00:42:27.199 --> 00:42:30.519
gets us to be with our characters
and have some pretty fun so far.

570
00:42:30.760 --> 00:42:35.079
Fair, I'm defending a season of
television that has yet to be finished.

571
00:42:35.440 --> 00:42:38.239
It could be a catastrophic I feel
like Kenny was like, you need to

572
00:42:38.239 --> 00:42:42.320
be watching you do need to be
watching Star Trek Discovery because it's a very

573
00:42:43.239 --> 00:42:49.440
from seasons three on is an extremely
emotional sincere version of Star Trek. I

574
00:42:49.519 --> 00:42:52.920
do love, yeah, in a
way that Star Trek. Star Trek is

575
00:42:52.920 --> 00:42:58.280
many things. I don't think anyone
has ever described Star Trek as extremely emotional

576
00:42:58.599 --> 00:43:04.280
until Discovery, until oh Startrek.
Yes, yeah, Star Wars that's been

577
00:43:04.320 --> 00:43:07.920
the advantage where the emotions are.
DS nine made me feel lots of feelings.

578
00:43:08.000 --> 00:43:12.960
Same yeah, DAS nine. But
let's be clear, DS Night's the

579
00:43:12.960 --> 00:43:16.599
best thing that's ever been created.
Das nine and actually something that does a

580
00:43:16.639 --> 00:43:23.280
deconstruction of expectations and mono myths.
It's true, sorry, finn I yes,

581
00:43:23.360 --> 00:43:28.760
yes, yes, I I think
there. You know how people will

582
00:43:28.800 --> 00:43:31.199
often hate the canto bite thing.
We love canto bybe. We love canto

583
00:43:31.239 --> 00:43:36.320
bite. Canto byte u is the
key to all I think so. I

584
00:43:36.360 --> 00:43:38.960
mean, Homie from The Leftover shows
up and does nothing great, love it

585
00:43:40.320 --> 00:43:46.320
does everything it is. I love
it because I one hundred percent like any

586
00:43:46.440 --> 00:43:50.880
graying of the expectations, and I
also love to see rich people get their

587
00:43:50.920 --> 00:43:54.159
shit fucked up. But more than
anything, of course, it is Finn's

588
00:43:54.320 --> 00:44:00.480
recognition of once again the idea of
the individual to the collective. He is

589
00:44:00.519 --> 00:44:02.760
also engaging in it on his own
journey. It is a frustrating art because

590
00:44:02.800 --> 00:44:07.400
Finn seems to be doing the exact
same arc that he did in Force Awakens,

591
00:44:07.440 --> 00:44:09.360
which is learning how to be a
good guy. And that's frustrating.

592
00:44:09.440 --> 00:44:15.199
But at the same time we get
Rose Yes, which is just like you

593
00:44:15.360 --> 00:44:19.320
love You love to see a person
who's just like, I don't know,

594
00:44:19.360 --> 00:44:22.880
I got wrenches. Yeah, she's
great, and she loves we love we

595
00:44:22.960 --> 00:44:27.880
love someone with a comedian sketch background. That's true, we love comedians.

596
00:44:27.960 --> 00:44:30.719
She loves Star Wars or she loves
the thought of Star Wars. And whereas

597
00:44:30.760 --> 00:44:34.840
everyone is treating the past as kind
of a bird and being like, you

598
00:44:34.840 --> 00:44:37.119
know, what's cool the past,
here's all the great things about it,

599
00:44:37.159 --> 00:44:40.079
while at the same time, and
the thing that I love the most,

600
00:44:40.760 --> 00:44:47.039
Uh, what is really frustrating about
so much Star Wars is they recognize the

601
00:44:47.039 --> 00:44:52.480
folks that are in charge of Star
Wars and writing all these ancillary materials are

602
00:44:52.519 --> 00:44:59.239
being like, well, Jeni versus
Sith Empire, where's the rebels. It's

603
00:44:59.320 --> 00:45:04.320
hard to it's hard to. They
stick to the same status quo and they

604
00:45:04.360 --> 00:45:07.719
have to for it to continue on
in perpetuity for our own capitalistic needs to

605
00:45:07.800 --> 00:45:12.239
keep putting out content InHand. And
so then they invent like what if they

606
00:45:12.280 --> 00:45:16.440
were gray Jedi, and what if
they were what if there was and again

607
00:45:16.440 --> 00:45:20.440
had an apprentice that you just never
knew about. And there are all of

608
00:45:20.480 --> 00:45:23.400
these things within canon that we love
ah sooaka more than anything in this world.

609
00:45:23.480 --> 00:45:27.920
Aspen does. I will come around
to it, but it's all these

610
00:45:27.960 --> 00:45:34.519
inventions that are extending material, and
what is really frustrating for me is basically

611
00:45:34.519 --> 00:45:37.719
it's authors being like, but actually, there's this really exciting thing that you

612
00:45:38.639 --> 00:45:45.079
was just off screen, and the
last Jedi is bothering to take the status

613
00:45:45.119 --> 00:45:50.559
quo as you know it and evolve
it. It's changing in a way that

614
00:45:50.760 --> 00:45:54.480
feels organic, case in point of
the Canto Bite, and it's the only

615
00:45:54.519 --> 00:46:00.800
material in Star Wars which is just
like specifically the scene where they are on

616
00:46:00.039 --> 00:46:05.880
the stolen ship, Rosenfinner on the
stolen ship with dj and they're looking at

617
00:46:06.000 --> 00:46:09.679
the fact that there's war profiteers and
me and my seat. It's just being

618
00:46:09.760 --> 00:46:14.480
like, is the status quo about
to be changed? Because now they're one.

619
00:46:14.639 --> 00:46:19.000
Now they're literally asking why these star
wars keep happening. And it was

620
00:46:19.960 --> 00:46:22.480
so tired of all these star wars, so tired of all these star wars'

621
00:46:22.719 --> 00:46:30.199
and I'm over here just so excited
because now the possibility for a whole bunch

622
00:46:30.199 --> 00:46:34.079
of different things have just opened up. There's a whole new enemy, and

623
00:46:34.159 --> 00:46:38.840
it doesn't feel like an invention.
It feels like extrapolation. And instead that's

624
00:46:38.880 --> 00:46:43.639
true until and Or, Yeah,
which I mean Last Jedi and and Or

625
00:46:43.760 --> 00:46:51.719
are very much of a piece in
terms of exploring modern day just modern day

626
00:46:51.960 --> 00:46:58.000
life, things that feel more relevant
and more complex. What's great about Last

627
00:46:58.079 --> 00:47:04.840
Jedi is that it's also being also
able to be creatively complicated yeah, while

628
00:47:04.840 --> 00:47:07.559
also still having kind of a light
tone. It does. Yeah, not

629
00:47:07.639 --> 00:47:13.320
only did this movie challenge you in
so many ways and do so many unexpected

630
00:47:13.360 --> 00:47:19.320
things, but it also gives you
the the pew pews and the lightsabers and

631
00:47:19.360 --> 00:47:22.079
all the fun stuff you love about
Star wars too, while also making it

632
00:47:22.119 --> 00:47:27.119
feel deeper. Yes, yeah,
funny, it's fun to watch, It's

633
00:47:27.159 --> 00:47:30.960
beautiful. Like, let's talk about
the iconography of it. Can I real

634
00:47:30.039 --> 00:47:34.400
quick? First? Real? Can
I argue with Kenny real fast? One?

635
00:47:34.440 --> 00:47:37.880
Two, three? Kenny, I
just disagree about the Finn arc and

636
00:47:37.880 --> 00:47:39.800
the more good ey icnography. Yeah, And the first one, I think

637
00:47:39.800 --> 00:47:44.679
he's going from I'm alone to I
have friends, and the second one is

638
00:47:44.719 --> 00:47:47.039
going from I have friends to I
am part of a bigger thing. Sure

639
00:47:47.400 --> 00:47:51.480
is all he cares about is Ray, and he only cares about Ray at

640
00:47:51.480 --> 00:47:53.400
the top, and then I think
by the end is like, I can

641
00:47:53.440 --> 00:47:57.480
be something more in this. I
think script wise, you're absolutely right,

642
00:47:57.519 --> 00:48:00.000
and I think that Ryan Johnson is
very adept because he is indeed yes,

643
00:48:00.119 --> 00:48:07.039
ending on Force Awakens. But asthetically, aspen what it feels, No,

644
00:48:08.679 --> 00:48:15.679
it feels like the same journey.
You are correct, but I think it

645
00:48:15.159 --> 00:48:20.760
it feels similar. I agree,
it feel also feels a little similar.

646
00:48:21.679 --> 00:48:23.719
All my all my flaws with last
Jedi, I point to Force Awakens and

647
00:48:23.760 --> 00:48:27.800
be like, that's that's actually the
problem. It's the setup that's the problem.

648
00:48:28.119 --> 00:48:30.639
Yeah, I mean, yeah,
and there could have been more to

649
00:48:30.719 --> 00:48:34.280
do with him, But you can
also easily see that being like, okay,

650
00:48:34.280 --> 00:48:37.639
well, if you go by what
I said, which is right to

651
00:48:37.719 --> 00:48:38.480
go into it, then it's like, okay, well, the next the

652
00:48:38.519 --> 00:48:44.719
third beat of that is take on
the like I'm actually leading the like former

653
00:48:44.840 --> 00:48:47.199
child soldier rebellion, I am engaging
with which they did. I am,

654
00:48:47.320 --> 00:48:51.440
I am a I can I am
for sensitive like all these other people,

655
00:48:51.480 --> 00:48:53.639
and but I am actually going to
be able to be like a Jedi or

656
00:48:53.639 --> 00:48:57.920
whatever that looks like now, and
I am leading this rebellion, which they

657
00:48:57.920 --> 00:49:01.599
did in the Colin traviroscript episode nine. Yeah, well, I don't trust

658
00:49:01.599 --> 00:49:06.280
Tomorrow, so I don't care.
It would have still been like this step

659
00:49:06.360 --> 00:49:08.239
down. But yeah, compare that
to the script that we got, and

660
00:49:08.280 --> 00:49:14.320
it is superior. Kind of sneeze
in that direction in the actual Rise of

661
00:49:14.320 --> 00:49:16.400
Skywalker they do. It's true.
It was. It was weird because I

662
00:49:16.440 --> 00:49:21.719
thought like the film had jumped,
But then I remember that film doesn't exist

663
00:49:22.559 --> 00:49:24.400
anymore, so I'd be like,
oh no, that was just a canonical

664
00:49:24.440 --> 00:49:30.400
sneeze. Sneezing is canonical, and
Star Wars now well allergy sorry iconography iconography,

665
00:49:30.679 --> 00:49:36.000
iconography for being part of franchise.
Yeah, Red rooms being part of

666
00:49:36.039 --> 00:49:39.599
a franchise that has existed for so
long, it's kind of a miracle that

667
00:49:39.639 --> 00:49:45.760
this movie stands apart in some ways
with its iconography, that it creates the

668
00:49:45.760 --> 00:49:49.800
red room, part of the red
stuff, the whole the whole room is

669
00:49:49.960 --> 00:49:52.639
red red. The whole room is
one big red just like Coruissant is one

670
00:49:52.880 --> 00:49:55.840
is a planet's one big senting like
did you I heard? I was on

671
00:49:55.920 --> 00:50:00.840
IMDb scrolling through the trivia of episode
one and I was reading some trivia about

672
00:50:00.880 --> 00:50:07.400
coarizont Do you know what? Do
you know any trivia about Courizont. I

673
00:50:07.440 --> 00:50:13.239
know that it is sometimes it looks
like Blade Runner, Oh it does what's

674
00:50:13.320 --> 00:50:15.280
best protest? And probably because the
reason of that is that the whole plan

675
00:50:15.400 --> 00:50:20.440
is one big city and last Night
has one big red room. It's got

676
00:50:20.519 --> 00:50:25.400
one big redroom, the whole room. Uh. Snoke's interior designer came along

677
00:50:25.400 --> 00:50:29.280
and was like, what if we
go ahead and just put like one curtain

678
00:50:29.320 --> 00:50:34.440
in front of the wind though Swedish, and then was like more and then

679
00:50:34.440 --> 00:50:37.920
it's like, you want two curtains, And then Snoke was like more,

680
00:50:37.880 --> 00:50:40.400
I can give you ten curtains.
I can go out back out to my

681
00:50:40.480 --> 00:50:45.199
van and I can go ahead and
get get the curtains, and then the

682
00:50:45.280 --> 00:50:49.199
curtains got to go to the target
and the Snoke is just linked one big

683
00:50:49.360 --> 00:50:54.519
curtain. Canonically, that's how it
happens. Is that how it happened?

684
00:50:54.599 --> 00:50:59.840
Yeah, Okay, it's in the
novelization. That's true. Yeah, legends,

685
00:51:00.159 --> 00:51:06.079
So you write it is in legends
canon, it's not. Actually yeah,

686
00:51:06.079 --> 00:51:09.079
it's like, yeah, Mike,
I'm s sorry. Do you still

687
00:51:09.119 --> 00:51:17.480
like this? You're okay? I
love you? Yes. So besides Red,

688
00:51:17.880 --> 00:51:22.960
which we do see in the big
battle with where Snoke likes to hang

689
00:51:22.000 --> 00:51:29.519
out and gets bisected and we see
in the sand the sand planet at the

690
00:51:29.639 --> 00:51:32.840
end, is it sand? It's
salt because I got a planet. Literally

691
00:51:34.000 --> 00:51:38.719
puts in his mouth and goes salt, salt, not ice. I think

692
00:51:38.719 --> 00:51:44.199
it's either him or the guy that's
right next to him is Gareth Edwards,

693
00:51:44.639 --> 00:51:47.519
which is rap. That's interesting.
Director of One, yeah, which is

694
00:51:49.119 --> 00:51:52.480
a war movie, solemn, Yeah, so many, so many people die

695
00:51:52.519 --> 00:51:55.800
in those film. Remember how Rogue
one has doctor Ebizon and it's just like,

696
00:51:55.920 --> 00:52:00.480
ah, remember that, who's doctor
Ebs? A guy in the tattooine

697
00:52:00.480 --> 00:52:07.280
bar who's like I've got the death
sentence on twelve systems. Yeah, ran

698
00:52:07.320 --> 00:52:13.199
into like the millennial version of them
on the street. So stupid. Anyways,

699
00:52:13.519 --> 00:52:16.239
So iconography, the Red Yeah,
the planet oh so cool, Kylo

700
00:52:16.320 --> 00:52:23.159
ran without a shirt icon Yes,
very much. Also old fucked up Luke

701
00:52:23.199 --> 00:52:28.840
Skywalker. Yes, which is amazing. It is such a fabulous look.

702
00:52:28.960 --> 00:52:34.079
Yeah, it's a great look.
And it's interesting that when he projects himself

703
00:52:34.119 --> 00:52:37.159
to kind of fight the battle and
be what everybody wants him to be,

704
00:52:37.280 --> 00:52:39.519
it looks like he did just for
men on his hair, yes and all

705
00:52:39.559 --> 00:52:43.639
that, and it looks cool,
but it's also saying, oh, this

706
00:52:43.719 --> 00:52:46.599
is what you want, this is
what this is what the uh the legend

707
00:52:46.639 --> 00:52:51.280
needs. This is what needs to
feel the fire of the rebellion, right,

708
00:52:51.679 --> 00:52:53.559
I need to look a little more
perfect and a little more action figury.

709
00:52:53.920 --> 00:53:00.280
So he does that. It works
on so many levels. And also

710
00:53:00.320 --> 00:53:06.159
it's cool. Also Leya in that
movie. Speaking of iconography, we haven't

711
00:53:06.199 --> 00:53:09.920
mentioned Leya here a great so cool
and powerful in this movie. Yeah,

712
00:53:10.039 --> 00:53:15.000
I'm always I hate that I'm like
responding to bad faith criticism, but I

713
00:53:15.119 --> 00:53:20.440
very specifically was like, let me
watch the blown out of the ship goes

714
00:53:20.480 --> 00:53:23.079
back into the ship scene with like
objectives objectively as I can, and I

715
00:53:23.119 --> 00:53:28.000
was like, fucking rules, this
is rad. But talking about talking about

716
00:53:28.000 --> 00:53:31.599
moments of crying and at that moment, oh my god, I just Fisher

717
00:53:31.639 --> 00:53:36.519
had passed before this movie premiered.
Yeah, and I was like, I'm

718
00:53:36.559 --> 00:53:40.519
actually getting chills just thinking about it
right now, which does not I am

719
00:53:40.519 --> 00:53:46.840
a less responsive viewer than Asmen,
but still quite responsive. Yeah. And

720
00:53:46.880 --> 00:53:52.679
then when Carrie Fisher is not or
when Leya is not in a coma in

721
00:53:52.679 --> 00:53:58.920
the movie there is she's got some
grad toss. Yeah, she's got a

722
00:53:58.960 --> 00:54:04.960
real ground toss. She's funny,
she's she's hot, she's allowed to have

723
00:54:05.000 --> 00:54:07.119
a real friendship with another woman in
power, yeah, which we've kind of

724
00:54:07.159 --> 00:54:13.599
never seen this. Yeah, I
hug. That was a bit frustrating to

725
00:54:13.679 --> 00:54:17.039
meet Holdo as opposed to like one
of the pre existing ad roles that we

726
00:54:17.039 --> 00:54:21.599
we'd met. But also like that's
a quibble. What it's frustrated to have

727
00:54:21.599 --> 00:54:22.840
a new character in that position.
I thought you were making a joke.

728
00:54:23.079 --> 00:54:25.840
I thought you were like, why
was it it? Acbar? No,

729
00:54:27.199 --> 00:54:30.000
not a bar, but like there
is a kill ac bar in this movie.

730
00:54:30.480 --> 00:54:38.400
Yeah. I was just like,
Okay, right, I kill acbar

731
00:54:38.519 --> 00:54:45.719
if you have to specifically kill.
Movie is one big act bar. No,

732
00:54:45.880 --> 00:54:50.960
I guess I mean that's a quibble
because we get so much thematic meaning

733
00:54:51.000 --> 00:54:57.920
from the holdo and poh, yes, the plot line. So, but

734
00:54:58.199 --> 00:55:00.599
I think it would have been a
little bit more meaningful for for me if

735
00:55:00.599 --> 00:55:07.519
it was like, because Leigh's pounding
around with uh, that one lady with

736
00:55:07.119 --> 00:55:13.000
there's the one lady. So this
is why I think you're wrong, because

737
00:55:13.000 --> 00:55:17.239
there's one lady with that business lady, one lady. See I'm trying to

738
00:55:17.239 --> 00:55:21.079
think. Are you talking about Ma
Mathma? Yeah, that's what I was

739
00:55:21.079 --> 00:55:23.639
thinking. She's got a big nose. Oh that lady. That lady.

740
00:55:23.960 --> 00:55:30.079
She's not an admiral. Whatever she
gets promoted, she's in charge. Okay,

741
00:55:30.840 --> 00:55:34.400
you know what, I'm not ever
going to complain about Laura Dern being

742
00:55:34.440 --> 00:55:39.599
in a film with the purple hair
and the robes. She's so hot.

743
00:55:39.679 --> 00:55:45.400
I wish I wish that her neck
was longer though. Oh I wish that

744
00:55:45.440 --> 00:55:51.960
it was Camino And like Kevin NEWANDRN
are those people who made the Clone?

745
00:55:52.239 --> 00:55:53.960
You guys like the bad Batch.
Yes, it's a good time. Yes,

746
00:55:54.039 --> 00:56:00.320
No, I like yes. My
fundamental issue is I can't and the

747
00:56:00.360 --> 00:56:02.599
voice actor of the Clones because I'm
like, you're doing a New Zealand action.

748
00:56:02.760 --> 00:56:06.679
He hates Steve Bradley Baker, which
is hilarious because step Bradley Baker he

749
00:56:07.440 --> 00:56:09.239
met him one time at his home. He blown up to his door and

750
00:56:09.239 --> 00:56:12.239
he said, I hate you,
and Dee Bradley Baker was like, get

751
00:56:12.280 --> 00:56:21.239
off my lawn, specifically, did
off my law Clanka Clanka Omiga Ahazy Bradley

752
00:56:21.239 --> 00:56:23.840
Baker Deep Bradley Baker a true icon
speaking of by iconography, and he's just

753
00:56:23.840 --> 00:56:25.559
like, I don't like this guy, and we're all just like, what

754
00:56:25.599 --> 00:56:29.960
the fuck. It's difficult, you
know why people don't. I'm sorry to

755
00:56:30.039 --> 00:56:32.239
keep doing this. You white people
don't like bad Badge because they hate girls.

756
00:56:32.639 --> 00:56:35.760
And they're like, Omega is annoying, and I'm like, she's not,

757
00:56:36.000 --> 00:56:37.800
well that's true or if or if
she's not like she is, but

758
00:56:37.840 --> 00:56:43.079
she gets to have like an arc
of becoming something like imagine little girl.

759
00:56:43.199 --> 00:56:45.840
Yeah, why do you hate girls? Because I just think that girls drool?

760
00:56:46.079 --> 00:56:54.280
You hate women and girls? I
like girls? Uh iconography read le

761
00:56:54.760 --> 00:57:00.760
Leah. I'm thinking about whenever she's
staring out from the hand you're on crate

762
00:57:00.639 --> 00:57:04.199
and oh she's got it over her
face. She's got the thing and she's

763
00:57:04.239 --> 00:57:09.079
like her little her like thing is
up and her eyes Ryan Ryan Johnson understands

764
00:57:09.679 --> 00:57:14.400
the stuff so well. And then
also Steve Yetlin, the director of photography

765
00:57:14.440 --> 00:57:19.519
on this an actual genius. DP
just under I mean, this movie just

766
00:57:20.000 --> 00:57:23.840
looks. It is probably my favorite
looking Star Wars. Yes, it is

767
00:57:23.880 --> 00:57:29.599
the best looking Star Wars movie.
It goes for something, it mostly achieves

768
00:57:29.639 --> 00:57:34.559
it. It stands apart while also
honoring the visuals of what came before,

769
00:57:34.760 --> 00:57:37.840
but adds to it in a in
a really cool way. It's fantastic.

770
00:57:39.760 --> 00:57:45.440
I'm sorry to engage with more bad
faith criticism, but when people were like,

771
00:57:45.039 --> 00:57:47.880
eh, you can hold on maneuver, why didn't they just do that

772
00:57:47.960 --> 00:57:53.239
before? That breaks everything because it's
movie, Because it's movie movie. That

773
00:57:53.280 --> 00:57:58.920
was an incredibly emotional, interesting,
cool sacrifice in that movie. It was

774
00:57:58.960 --> 00:58:01.239
awesome. And then and when I
remember when I went to the theater,

775
00:58:01.320 --> 00:58:05.880
there were maybe this was at your
theater's too, somebody had like taped a

776
00:58:05.920 --> 00:58:08.440
sign to the door that said,
hey, dummy. There's a portion of

777
00:58:08.480 --> 00:58:12.920
this movie where the audio goes out. It's not because the theater was broken.

778
00:58:13.239 --> 00:58:15.400
It's because that's how the movie.
So oh, I hate that someone

779
00:58:15.440 --> 00:58:20.280
even had to do that. I
remember that moment so distinctly. Again,

780
00:58:20.320 --> 00:58:22.320
it was so late or this might
be at that point like two in the

781
00:58:22.320 --> 00:58:24.320
morning or something, and I just
remember, like you know those, I

782
00:58:24.480 --> 00:58:29.199
was like one of those moments,
like it happened, and it was like

783
00:58:29.239 --> 00:58:34.840
my entire body was on fire.
It was yeah, like what a wild

784
00:58:35.039 --> 00:58:37.400
idea, which is why yeah,
I'm like stop it. I will often

785
00:58:37.480 --> 00:58:42.679
forgive things too, if they are
thematically or emotionally resonant, like if something

786
00:58:42.760 --> 00:58:45.239
like I'm like, okay, it's
sure, the internal logic of it doesn't

787
00:58:45.280 --> 00:58:49.880
quite work. Okay, cares like
I'm not here to read a science text

788
00:58:49.920 --> 00:58:53.159
book like I'm here to watch a
film. But also I think that a

789
00:58:53.199 --> 00:58:59.519
certain sect of fandom had been treated
to read this stuff like a Wikipedia page,

790
00:59:00.679 --> 00:59:05.719
which is so that is just interesting
and also just one of my frustrated

791
00:59:06.079 --> 00:59:10.800
frustrations with expanded universe stuff in Star
Wars because so much of it. I've

792
00:59:10.880 --> 00:59:15.159
read a couple of high republic comics
and I'm just like you were. It

793
00:59:15.280 --> 00:59:22.639
is just all plot stuff, there's
not much. I haven't read the books,

794
00:59:22.760 --> 00:59:27.280
and I don't mean to disparas the
authors, but just reading the High

795
00:59:27.360 --> 00:59:30.400
Republic Comics volumes wanted to and I'm
just like, this is extremely difficult.

796
00:59:30.400 --> 00:59:34.880
There's barely any characterization, is just
throwing you all plot. And I think

797
00:59:35.400 --> 00:59:42.239
because a lot of the Expanded Universe
canon that folks grew up with was just

798
00:59:42.840 --> 00:59:47.199
other variations of Luke Skywalker and the
Gang would get into more trouble and here's

799
00:59:47.199 --> 00:59:52.639
some plot stuff, and here's Mandalorians
and Dark Sabers and all of this stuff,

800
00:59:52.639 --> 00:59:57.000
and I remember, it's just like
lazy IP extensions stuff. Like I

801
00:59:57.079 --> 01:00:01.159
was talking about this on our most
recent episode of Trek War is talking about

802
01:00:01.159 --> 01:00:06.679
Thron and how in reading Air to
the Empire and Dark Force Rising as an

803
01:00:06.679 --> 01:00:10.280
adult because I didn't grow up with
those things, but I'd read other Star

804
01:00:10.320 --> 01:00:15.000
Wars, I'd read other stuff,
but like reading that as an adult,

805
01:00:15.039 --> 01:00:19.480
I'm just like, this is this
is pretty lazy. But I understand if

806
01:00:19.519 --> 01:00:22.800
I had read that at twelve or
thirteen, I'd be like, yeah,

807
01:00:22.880 --> 01:00:25.760
yeah, this is really powerful stuff. But it truly does feel like you're

808
01:00:25.800 --> 01:00:32.840
inventing because you have to extend the
brand as opposed to what is thematically meaningful

809
01:00:34.000 --> 01:00:38.639
and it I think it's trained certain
brains to be like, we have to

810
01:00:38.679 --> 01:00:45.440
respect information, we have to respect
lore, because that's that's how I connected

811
01:00:45.440 --> 01:00:49.800
with Star Wars at this point in
time, and I loved that. And

812
01:00:49.840 --> 01:00:52.639
that's not the way Ryan Johnson approaches
this. He approaches as, Oh,

813
01:00:52.679 --> 01:00:55.199
we're gonna do it the Star Wars. But why though? Yeah, I

814
01:00:55.199 --> 01:00:59.599
mean I know why because of money, But why though? Really? Why?

815
01:00:59.760 --> 01:01:01.280
Why? Real? Why make another
movie? Why do you think?

816
01:01:01.400 --> 01:01:06.840
And it's unfortunate because you like Mandalorian
more than I do. Yeah, but

817
01:01:06.880 --> 01:01:10.599
Mandalorian is flawed, and I was
frustrated whenever I watched the first couple episodes

818
01:01:10.599 --> 01:01:14.440
of just being like, Okay,
all that Star Wars is going to be

819
01:01:14.480 --> 01:01:20.119
from now on is style exercises.
That's fine, I like unless it's Ander

820
01:01:20.599 --> 01:01:27.719
and which also lost in the Imperial
March Madness bracket. Oh against against against

821
01:01:28.360 --> 01:01:30.920
we got mad. That also upset
us. Yeah, I like it to

822
01:01:30.960 --> 01:01:36.000
learn bit, but it's because it's
fun and or is work of art,

823
01:01:36.519 --> 01:01:39.920
Yeah, because it's actually making a
statement about what it is to truly,

824
01:01:40.199 --> 01:01:45.000
you could remove the Star Wars label
from it, and I could PLoP it

825
01:01:45.079 --> 01:01:47.639
down in front of anyone and be
like, watch this, You're going to

826
01:01:47.719 --> 01:01:52.920
get something from this. When that
little robot is sad, I'm also sad.

827
01:01:53.360 --> 01:01:59.320
That's true. It works. Speaking
of robots, I'd forgotten how much

828
01:01:59.360 --> 01:02:04.519
I love to be maybe like he
gets Paul Droid. Yeah, the Paul

829
01:02:04.599 --> 01:02:07.599
Dassian. I love that he's so
tiny, you know, you put him

830
01:02:07.599 --> 01:02:08.960
next to you, put him next
to R two. He's like a little

831
01:02:08.960 --> 01:02:12.960
baby, just a little guy.
He's just like a little pop up,

832
01:02:13.119 --> 01:02:16.000
a little baby, little baby in
that little part and candle bite where the

833
01:02:16.079 --> 01:02:20.480
guy is just like putting coins in
him and he's drunk. I love that

834
01:02:20.519 --> 01:02:24.559
with all of my heart. I
love that. It's the only part of

835
01:02:24.599 --> 01:02:29.400
the movie that took me a second
viewing to really dig was the canto vibe

836
01:02:29.400 --> 01:02:32.880
stuff. Didn't hate it, didn't, you know, not not like outrightly

837
01:02:32.920 --> 01:02:36.440
rejecting it, but yeah, it
felt like, oh, this just could

838
01:02:37.119 --> 01:02:40.320
move along a little faster for me, And that was it. I probably

839
01:02:40.320 --> 01:02:44.639
have other criticisms of the movie,
but as a whole, it's profound.

840
01:02:44.800 --> 01:02:46.679
Yeah, it's a profound movie.
What a joy, what a joy.

841
01:02:46.800 --> 01:02:52.519
Before time, Before we wrap,
guys, talk to me about your pod

842
01:02:52.360 --> 01:02:57.760
and tell me what's next what because
this is gonna drop in a couple of

843
01:02:57.760 --> 01:03:01.480
weeks. So what's next on Truck
Wars. As of this recording of this

844
01:03:01.519 --> 01:03:08.599
episode, we are on any cusp
of a very exciting shift dynamic. Okay,

845
01:03:09.079 --> 01:03:13.960
for like, so we're going in
chronological order, as you so wonderfully

846
01:03:14.000 --> 01:03:16.599
detailed at the top, which means
that we've literally but we've been comparing Star

847
01:03:16.679 --> 01:03:22.679
Trek properties to Star Wars properties literally
in order as they came out. So

848
01:03:22.719 --> 01:03:24.119
that means that, Okay, you
start with the Star Wars and you start

849
01:03:24.159 --> 01:03:28.280
with the first episode of Star Trek
originals. Right, everyone loves the first

850
01:03:28.280 --> 01:03:31.199
episode of Star Trek, and everyone
loves Star Wars, Star Wars heard of

851
01:03:31.199 --> 01:03:35.679
it, good movie, heard of
it. But then you eventually are like,

852
01:03:35.719 --> 01:03:38.519
oh wait, the next thing is
Star Wars Droids, Star Wars e

853
01:03:38.679 --> 01:03:42.360
Boks stories, and that's what we
were on for. It felt like a

854
01:03:42.519 --> 01:03:47.199
y we actually was Revenge of Kypo
Wren heard Heart of It? Is that

855
01:03:47.239 --> 01:03:52.559
a character? Yes, there there's
there's a slight conspiracy theory that I have

856
01:03:52.679 --> 01:03:57.440
because there are a lot not a
lot, but like a surprising amount of

857
01:03:57.480 --> 01:04:01.800
elements that are that Android again,
the Force Awaken. Yeah, it's pretty

858
01:04:01.840 --> 01:04:08.199
it's pretty good, including a space
pirate named caibo ren hyber wren So.

859
01:04:08.320 --> 01:04:10.639
And it's not like any of that
was bad, but it's it's a very

860
01:04:11.079 --> 01:04:14.079
We were in it for a while, as we have both said, we

861
01:04:14.199 --> 01:04:18.400
had to learn how to appreciate those
things. Because there's what is so fascinating

862
01:04:18.400 --> 01:04:25.320
about Droid's knee Woks is that there's
this two year chunk of Star Wars that

863
01:04:25.519 --> 01:04:30.639
no one talks about. Meanwhile,
there's like hundreds of people that worked very

864
01:04:30.679 --> 01:04:34.679
hard and for two years, this
is what Star Wars was, was droids

865
01:04:34.719 --> 01:04:40.519
and for babies, and then after
that, no people talk about the Holiday

866
01:04:40.559 --> 01:04:45.320
special more than they talked about Drits
and eons right right, And and there

867
01:04:45.400 --> 01:04:46.639
was there was a lot of value
in it. And there's a lot of

868
01:04:46.719 --> 01:04:49.599
value seeming like if people were like, oh my gosh, what are you

869
01:04:49.639 --> 01:04:54.840
like comparing Apple storranges? Sure,
but you find so many thematic connections in

870
01:04:54.960 --> 01:04:58.400
everything and it brings up interesting thoughts. So what we're about to get into,

871
01:04:58.760 --> 01:05:02.039
we're about to finally get into the
Clone Wars, the Clone Wars film,

872
01:05:02.079 --> 01:05:04.320
and then the Clone Wars show,
which, of course, as we

873
01:05:04.360 --> 01:05:06.519
know, it's going to go for
six seasons, but then other stuff happened

874
01:05:06.559 --> 01:05:10.960
in the seventh season recently came out
in the past few years, so that

875
01:05:10.960 --> 01:05:13.440
one will be in the future.
But we're about to do that versus and

876
01:05:13.480 --> 01:05:15.639
we're about to start the third season
of Start Trek original series. Yeah,

877
01:05:15.679 --> 01:05:19.760
it's it's timing up really nicely to
where we're starting the Clone Wars exactly the

878
01:05:19.800 --> 01:05:25.159
same time as we start with Spocks
Brains. So I think the inversion is

879
01:05:25.239 --> 01:05:29.719
going to be real nice in terms
of quality probably, and then you'll still

880
01:05:29.760 --> 01:05:32.400
be in Clone Wars when you're doing
the Trek movies. Yeah, right,

881
01:05:32.480 --> 01:05:36.320
okay, well we'll be in Clone
Wars territory for the rest of our lives.

882
01:05:38.840 --> 01:05:42.039
Yeah. To TG, can you
mean a spreadsheet? Because he's so

883
01:05:42.119 --> 01:05:49.119
good at this love and I'm funny. Yeah, I try to do research.

884
01:05:49.199 --> 01:05:51.440
Beginning's better at it. I'm just
like, did you know? I

885
01:05:51.519 --> 01:05:55.760
cried? Well you did? You
did your research for our episode that we

886
01:05:55.840 --> 01:05:59.159
recorded this week, which was episode
three versus Bread and Circuses. Yeah,

887
01:05:59.280 --> 01:06:02.960
I watched the six our video essay
called The Decaying Monomth by Jesse Earl jesse

888
01:06:03.039 --> 01:06:06.119
Gender. Oh yeah, I like
her. Oh my gosh. Yeah.

889
01:06:06.199 --> 01:06:10.000
Yeah, we're still gonna get you
on that podcast on our podcast, Mike,

890
01:06:10.199 --> 01:06:13.280
I would love to you, sweet. I was in Denver last time,

891
01:06:13.280 --> 01:06:15.719
so I couldn't do it. But
that's trip sooner or later. Yeah,

892
01:06:15.880 --> 01:06:17.800
whenever you want. And you guys
are free to record here whenever you

893
01:06:17.800 --> 01:06:21.440
want. Shut I let this is
why I have the spot to help my

894
01:06:21.559 --> 01:06:27.440
friends lay when you want. Just
let me know, all right, I

895
01:06:27.440 --> 01:06:35.039
feel so much more professional here.
Uh okay, remind everybody where to listen

896
01:06:35.079 --> 01:06:40.199
to the pod and where to find
your things. Yeah. Starting out,

897
01:06:40.239 --> 01:06:43.440
you can go to track warspod dot
com to find all the relevant links.

898
01:06:43.440 --> 01:06:46.639
Of course, because we want to
steal all of your money for our own

899
01:06:46.679 --> 01:06:50.079
devious purposes, please go to patreon
dot com slash track wars Pod. We're

900
01:06:50.119 --> 01:06:54.400
for five dollars a month. You
can get early versions of our episodes and

901
01:06:54.440 --> 01:06:59.239
extended versions of our episodes like our
most recent episode three versus Bread and Circuses

902
01:06:59.280 --> 01:07:02.840
episode or know That's reason when we
talked about Jaws, I saw the first

903
01:07:03.000 --> 01:07:08.880
Sorry, I would think about Clone
Wars Volume two versus whatever the Star Trek

904
01:07:08.880 --> 01:07:11.719
is. Can we oh yeah,
the Ultimate Computer, which was just oh

905
01:07:11.880 --> 01:07:15.800
so absolute bangers. And then my
favorite thing that I've talked about as a

906
01:07:15.840 --> 01:07:18.840
tangent, my ten point plan on
how to improve the Star Wars prequels.

907
01:07:19.000 --> 01:07:21.360
So if you want that ten point
plan, you have to be a patron.

908
01:07:21.599 --> 01:07:26.079
Yeah, so for five smackers a
month. Otherwise you can just listen

909
01:07:26.119 --> 01:07:29.960
to it. Yeah, that's true. And then you can find us on

910
01:07:30.000 --> 01:07:31.719
Instagram and on Blue Sky. I've
got blue Sky on my phone. I

911
01:07:31.800 --> 01:07:34.760
check it regularly. You can also
still go to Twitter. You can't go

912
01:07:34.800 --> 01:07:39.239
to Twitter, but I prefer to
just stay off. It's It's Truck Wars

913
01:07:39.239 --> 01:07:42.679
Pod trek warspot dot com. Yeah, yeah, that's it cool. Thank

914
01:07:42.719 --> 01:07:45.239
you guys. This was awesome.
We'll have you back very soon, hopefully

915
01:07:45.280 --> 01:07:49.000
talking Matrix Resurrections, the movie that
both of us What Love. No,

916
01:07:49.360 --> 01:07:55.119
at least one of you will be
on here talking Matrix Resurrections sooner or later.

917
01:07:55.599 --> 01:07:58.960
Uh yeah. Find the pod Intergalacticpod
dot co. My name's Mike.

918
01:07:59.000 --> 01:08:02.280
Find me on what's the thing that
I'm on Instagram and the other one the

919
01:08:02.320 --> 01:08:08.039
threads at the threads at Mike Moody
Garcia. Are you guys on threads,

920
01:08:08.480 --> 01:08:14.039
No, should we be? Should
we be? I don't know. I

921
01:08:14.039 --> 01:08:16.880
don't really engage it very much either. Yeah, intergalacticpod dot co. We

922
01:08:16.920 --> 01:08:20.359
don't have a Patreon, but just
follow us there, follow the pod.

923
01:08:20.560 --> 01:08:21.319
Thanks for listening.