Rookies vs. Is There In Truth No Beauty?

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Welcome to the Track Wars podcast,
the one podcast that dares to answer the

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most important question in fandom, which
is better Star Trek or Star Wars by

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going through both franchises and chronological release
order. I am Kenny Madison of the

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Star Trek contingent with me as always
is. It's me Aspen Webster, a

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true Star Wars fan. Don't at
met fanboys, just in case it's true.

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You know your stuff. You're certainly
not a rookie, unlike rookies that

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we're covering today. That's right,
we're covering rookies from Star Wars to Clone

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War season one, versus is There
in Truth No Beauty? From Star Trek

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to the original series season three?
That is that title is the title I

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will never be able to remember.
I was like trying to look it up

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just to like I was just going
through and I was just to do some

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research. I didn't do much,
and then I was just like, is

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truth Beauty? No in the sky
flowers? But also Star Trek has litany

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of extremely long titles for the world
is hollow and I can touch the sky

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and I have touched the sky?
What are little girls made of? Well?

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I don't see that one's easier because
Sarah truth no beauty is there a

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truth? No beauty is at Shakespeare. I forget. It's sighted somewhere in

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my book. But before we get
to the actual research, of course,

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we have some correspond sound. The
whistle was absolutely and so let's let's deal

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with this correspondence before we get too
far into it. Uh. From the

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Patreon Patreon dot com slash trek Wars
pod uh user feel yet. In reference

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to our last episode and talking about
the folony Zoni, Feliat cites it and

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says a more civilized age A great
Star Wars podcast at trust note truly calls

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it folony zone. I just thought
that was the name. That doesn't offer

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more clarity on it. What exactly
the polony zone is? You just gave

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a citation, which I appreciate.
Uh. User Feliat, whoever you are.

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If you're get to add some more
context, that would be great.

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Please don't or not, That's fine. Let's keep it just the way it

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is. It's like a little uncomfortable. Uh. From user Arizona Mark,

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also on Patreon dot com slash truck
Wars pod, Kenny, that's me editor's

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note, He asked me to share
how my Spider Monday viewings have been going.

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For the last several weeks, theaters
across the country have been showing every

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single theatrical Spider Man movie in theaters, and our friend Arizona Mark that's Cannon,

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has been going with his son.
It's been interesting to watch through Toby

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Maguire to Andrew Garfield and now Tom
Holland this week and how each film tries

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to do their own thing while keeping
that correspond of what makes Spider Man slash

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Peter Parker great. Have two weeks
left to Spider Monday after seeing Homecoming this

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week has been great to see the
Toby films with my son as he never

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got to experience those in theaters.
But his favorite is Andrew Garfield as he

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doesn't feel people appreciate him enough as
Spider Man. We love to champion underdog,

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even though Andrew Garfield is so hot. Yeah, I mean is not?

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Are you truly an underdog? If
he's not really an underdog? When

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that guy Andrew Garfield, do remember
when he flirted with the chicken shop date

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girl on a red carpet? Nope, nope, Oh my god, there's

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like just look it up. So
that the chicken so I can put it

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in the notes. She just she
because you know what I'm talking about,

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Like she goes on dates with people, like a chicken shop date, and

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she interview. I believe you have
mentioned this once and I gave you the

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exact same reaction, which is cause
again I can't reiterate enough. My internet,

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your internet radically very different internets,
very I don't know if you know

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this. I like to research and
I like to learn a lot of things.

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There's not a slide on you.
Sorry, wait, if you like

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to research things, what am I
doing feeling experiencing saying put the books away.

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There's a sunset out there. Look
at that, and not every sunset

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it's going to be a different sunset. I probably and talked about this exact

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exchange before. It's just my favorite, Like I don't know, she yeah,

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she has. She does it just
as a reminder she she does interviews.

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But it's like a date with her, and it's just like she's just

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that much weird and a little awkward, and it works, it's so great.

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And he starts talking to her on
this red carpet. She's doing like

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the kind of like interview stuff and
it's electric. The entire internet was like,

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date, Date please. Not to
be weird, but you look like

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you want to Both of you are
hot anyway, We are with you,

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We're We're with your son, Arizona
Mark. Not only is that, there's

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two pieces more from Arizona Mark,
also Arizona Mark agrees with you asmen on

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Kingdom of the Crystal Skull. Thank
you wha. And finally, did the

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Power Rangers movie from ninety five.
That's the premise of this track episode with

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adults being incapacitated and children having to
take over. No because there's no goo

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or ooze. Oh my gosh.
I was obsessed with that movie, and

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I like, can't even remember what
happened, but I was like I was

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a huge Power rangest fan, and
I was like, this is this is

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the movie of my life. Same
Oh my god. I remember we went

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to McDonald's first so that I could
get the toys toys in the kit in

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the kids meals specifically, I was
like, I need the toys and we're

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gonna go see the movie. Oh
my gosh. But if you're remembering right,

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you're right. I'm certain that there
will be goo and ooze that takes

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over some Star Trek thing gross later
on, I'm sure Star Wars like that.

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There's gotta be oohs, goo and
oos. I'll think on it.

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And finally, this last piece of
correspondence comes into us via Trek warspot at

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gmail dot com from Austin Aaron,
Hi, kids, Glory. Sorry,

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unbelievable this amateur hour, so I
just can't it comfortable, Hike, Kenny

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and Aspen. I missed most of
Clone Wars when it came out and revisited

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it during the pandemic. This was
the episode that sold me on the series.

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I believe that this is in reference
to our previous episode that we recorded,

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which I will tell you what is
the story that's it? Yep,

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thank you. I yes, broad
storytelling where each line is fodder for either

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blatant characterization or world building, over
the top morality and dad movie plots abound

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in good triumphs over evil just in
time for supper. That's the same recipe

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that I think makes the Ridge Tridge
the gooey nostalgia field touchdown for our generation.

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Also, we meet a clone with
gray hair parentheses rip sarch is that

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a SPOILERD and Rex and five is
an echo oh, this might be a

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reference to today's episode. Yes,
do either of you have similar episodes that

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serve as the benchmark for either Trek
or Wars, especially ones that don't highlight

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the usual suspects of Kirk Khan,
Lance, Bock or Bones Luke for tax

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purposes, I am a rishy eel
Austin Aaron ps, Hello, Obi,

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Wan's good man. That Cody definitely
my starship this week is Cody w PPS

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JTPS I starship. It is a
solid bop that must be in reference to

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Oh my partner Joe. It is
such a bop I like I often replay

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each week when it comes on PPPs
REX shot first. Uh, do either

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of us have similar episodes that serves
the benchmark for either Trek or Wars?

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Means cliche? Well, it's,
Austin Aaron says, especially once I don't

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highlight the usual suspects of Kirkhan LEAs
Black or Bones Luke. I mean,

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yes, so we're going atypical,
I mean minor, going to be clone

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Wars and Rebels oriented. The question
being that it's like this is emblematic of

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it in terms of like it's spirit
like the kinds that he was talking about

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because I'm trying to differentiate that from
like my favorite things. You know,

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but I've said before, Suit of
good. Last four episodes of Clone Wars

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season seven truly like incredible, tight
storytelling. It's a film unto itself,

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has very clear points of view.
You know exactly what's going on. It

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is fabulous action, extraordinary work,
deeply emotional whilst and like it doesn't have

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it's not really wrapped up. I
mean it's wrapped up as nicely as it

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and as it can be because it
leads ultimately and it is leading right into

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Revenged the set, which is very
sad and like Order sixty six stuff,

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I mean that happens during it.
So and probably some Rebels episodes that's for

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my Star Wars piece. Certainly,
this may be territory that we have covered

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in our Primer Star Trek sast Star
Wars episode that we did. Being like,

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I want to get into these things. Yeah, here's some prime uh

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things doing great, doing great.
Sometimes I can phone it in, can't

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I? Here are some things that
you can consume without having to you know,

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swim entirely in both of the things. The first thing that comes to

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my mind, that's a little bit
atypical, might be Yesterday's Enterprise, which

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is still like a Picard heavy episode. Also like, it's a it's a

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dark, weird episode. You got
weird time travel stuff, an incredible moral

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quandary at the center of the argument, get one of my favorite ships in

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the Enterprise seat. It's great,
it's a it's an outstanding episode. Other

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episodes that come to mind are far
Beyond the Stars from DS nine. Also

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also, oh my god, Oh
my god, oh boy, what's the

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episode where Cisco talks to the camera. That's the one I was thinking of.

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Oh shit, dude, oh my
god. In the Pale Moonlight of

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course, uh, outstanding episode.
Honestly, it gets clowned on. But

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two Vix is a heck of an
episode, a very strong, dark episode,

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incredible moral quandary. Loves and then
also, oh what about that one

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where Jane Way is like hot and
having to like fight her way through things.

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Oh, oh, like anything where
like there's god, there's this episod

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there's an episode Ofvoyager where there's like
two there's two Voyagers, Like it's like

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something has happened where there's now like
I believe it's called shattered. Oh that

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episode fucked me up, and I
think that I swear, I swear I'm

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not like going for like just my
favorites. But I think when we're trying,

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especially with something something like what are
the questions that Star Trek is asking,

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I guess around, like what is
it to be a person? To

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exist? The ways that it kind
of subverts your expectations at the last moment

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and like strong characterizations. That's that's
an episode I think too that just like

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wrecked me. Yeah, yeah,
I'm sorry, no worries and then gosh,

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really, I just want people to
watch strange New Worlds. Yeah,

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spock a mock the oh yeah,
the silliest hell episode and also surprisingly affirming.

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There's an incredible subplot that feeds into
what exactly Star Trek is while also

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being light, because it's really easy
to quate Star Trek with dark, serious

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philosophical stuff. But you gotta remember
it's this is the exact same series where

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Kirk had to fight a giant cat
once a cat's pa. We're not talking

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about Austin Aaron. I love that
question. Thank you so much, folks.

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If you are listening and want to
send us correspondence, you could send

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us email trek warspod at gmail dot
com or sign up to the Patreon Patreon

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dot com slash track Wars pod for
five smackers a month. Smackers like that's

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what I do with my uh to
my microphone on accident because I moved my

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hands a lot. Speaking of smacking, smacking, you smacking on me,

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I'm going to smack some sense into
our new listeners who might not be necessarily

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watching along with us, and we
should give our synapsis for both rookies and

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is there in truth no perfect?
Would you like for me to go first

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asthmer? Uh? No? Interesting? Okay, I will wait then,

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Okay, I can do it.
Okay, we are doing Star Wars Clone

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Wars the Clone Wars sorry episode Clone
Wars Clone Wars season one, episode five

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Rookies, which might have been Aaron
was talking about because this episode is by

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Yar, but we'll get into that. Air date October twenty fourth, two

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thousand and eight. Director Justin Ridge, writer Stephen Melching summaries plot synopsis.

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Basically, here's the official description.
Alone. On a distant outpost, Clone

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Commander Cody and Clone Captain Rex must
inspire the Rookie Clones to believe in themselves

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to stave off a commando droid invasion
with introductions of some fabulous Clone characters and

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fabulous new scary battle commando droids.
It's great, sounds intense. It's probably

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going to be like a dark episode
with absolutely no fun. Is that correct?

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I would say that if I were
to give it qualification, I'd say,

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don't air this on Cartoon Network in
two thousand and eight. Don't do

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that. Children might watch it and
nope. I mean a clone does get

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eaten by a giant eel. It's
like not not not. Kids love watching

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people get eaten. That's one of
the reasons why dresses parks so popular.

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Kids also love scary things. Kids
do love scary things. They love things

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that make them feel weird. Speaking
of things that make you feel weird,

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is there in truth? No Beauty? First aired October eighteenth, nineteen sixty

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eight. Director Ralph Zoninski, writer
Jeanette or Else arrests. Don't exactly know

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how to say her name because this
is her first credited episode, because she

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was a librarian. She was a
librarian. From an NBC press release.

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On September seventeenth, nineteen sixty eight, released Mister Spock after gazing upon a

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mendusin sick will die of badness unless
Captain Kirk can persuade a woman already jealous

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of Spock's mental powers to save him
by performing a dangerous mind blink. In

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the episode is There a Truth No
Beauty, Diana Maltar guest stars Miranda,

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a woman resentful responsibility to mentally communicate
with the medusin the sight of which drews

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humans insane, and David Frankem is
Marvick her jealousyter I hate that description.

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Sure, well, it's coming right
from NBC, which, as we've established

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in the narrative, NBC is full
steam Ahead, loves Star Trek, loves

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Geene Roddenberry, and it's just like, you know what, let's shoot our

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money cannons at it. That's just
sound. It's just like so funny,

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Like whoever sat down to write that
copy was like, what am I gonna

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just spend the most time on It's
going to be like a portion of this

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in an extraordinarily reductive and fairly misogynistic
way. But that's just me, That's

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just you. That's just me who
feels that way. Just that's just you.

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As that's just like me. Yeah, let's go into her first impressions.

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How do we feel about these apps? Spoilerer? Both of them are

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good? Thank you? Okay,
okay, thank you, You're welcome.

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Cool, awesome, all right,
should we move on? Great? Okay.

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Sorry, it's just that like sometimes
I'll watch Star Trek episodes and I'll

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be like, so I'm like looking
up an IMDb, like I'll watch them

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without Oh my god, Aspen,
what was going on over there? I'm

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00:17:49.839 --> 00:17:56.160
so sorry. Sorry, I need
to move things. What is going on?

203
00:17:56.359 --> 00:17:59.400
I'm moving my hands around so much. Yeah, you're in about a

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person. I'm sorry. I last
night I went for a night swim.

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What does that have to do with
you slapping the microphone? That was yesterday?

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No, it was late and I
went for a night women because I

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was feeling feelings and the night swim
really helped. But then it meant that

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I went to bed really like because
I had to shower because it was swimming

209
00:18:18.359 --> 00:18:21.240
and chlorine. This very gross.
But I'll wake up for a dentist appointment

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and I've just been sleepy all day, so I hit the microphone. You

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hit the microphone so you can stay
awake. I'm sorry that my company is

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00:18:32.319 --> 00:18:36.000
so boring. No, I'm trying. I'm just I don't know what's happening

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with my hands. This last thing
I'll lose when I you know what that

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00:18:41.519 --> 00:18:56.079
you know what that is haspen what
that's rookie behavior. You know what I

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00:18:56.119 --> 00:19:11.559
say to that is boot beauty in
truth? None there. Oh. What

216
00:19:11.640 --> 00:19:17.279
I was saying was that I will
watch episodes and then without knowing really anything

217
00:19:17.279 --> 00:19:19.480
about them, because I had not
seen this episode before, nor had I

218
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even really heard about it. Great, there's fifteen minutes of the questions,

219
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had of course seen Rookies. Was
very excited when yeah, it's Rookies time.

220
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This episode is great. This is
actually this is actually the episode where

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it does sort of like you're like
got it. In the limited amount that

222
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I know about Clone Wars mythology that
hasn't already been put into stuff like Rabbels

223
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or mandaloriin or things like that,
I understand that Rookies is a very important

224
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episode. Watching this episode, I
see why because not to jump I'm going

225
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to jump ahead. Sure, but
it's a little bit of how the public

226
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conception of what Bottle episodes are,
as well as a production standpoint, Bottle

227
00:20:06.559 --> 00:20:11.880
episode is defined by a community.
That's a commonality that both of these episodes

228
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have. They are both using pre
existing assets and not really having to build

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new stuff except for the station,
but then they use that in the future,

230
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so I get to reuse it.
Yes, but yeah, yeah,

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a lot of the assets are the
same. But yes, specifically because we

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watch we watched the same felony zone
we did. But yeah, the fact

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that they're all it's all the same
clone, It's all the same person,

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just with slight differences, and it's
all the same voice actor. Well,

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but the wonderful thing about I mean, it's not great for production, but

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what it forces the writer to do
on a good day is double down on

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character. Yes, and that's what
both of these episodes have in common so

238
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much with And not only that,
but kind of these side characters come to

239
00:21:07.000 --> 00:21:11.519
the front. But with the Clone
Wars, you are introducing side characters that

240
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will actually become main characters, as
opposed to the original series, which is

241
00:21:17.000 --> 00:21:22.640
kind of a character piece about this
extremese character that we will never ever see

242
00:21:22.680 --> 00:21:29.599
again, but at the same time
as such a rich, complex character.

243
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I so I watched the episode,
great, wonderful, here we go give

244
00:21:38.400 --> 00:21:41.680
it up. For as everyone so
much. Everybody, thank you so much.

245
00:21:42.599 --> 00:21:51.079
I am. I am so good
at this, great at podcasting,

246
00:21:51.759 --> 00:21:56.799
so good. I looked at I
like, looked up IMDb afterwards some other

247
00:21:56.920 --> 00:22:00.680
things, and it's not rated.
It's not like the rating. It's super

248
00:22:00.799 --> 00:22:03.920
high. Whereas I came out of
it being a little like, no,

249
00:22:04.079 --> 00:22:07.720
I really really enjoyed that. So
I was just surprised, and so I

250
00:22:07.839 --> 00:22:11.279
was curious about how you would have
felt about it, Like I was like,

251
00:22:11.359 --> 00:22:15.440
is this one where like you're not
feeling it, but I'm feeling most

252
00:22:15.440 --> 00:22:18.359
of it. I think the episode
ends and it keeps going for another ten

253
00:22:18.400 --> 00:22:23.640
minutes, and that feels kind of
anti climactic because our ambassador pilots the ship

254
00:22:23.680 --> 00:22:30.160
out of the barrier that is surrounding
the galaxy, and it feels very climactic.

255
00:22:30.200 --> 00:22:36.400
But the episode is not about the
Meducee Ambassador. It is about Miranda

256
00:22:36.480 --> 00:22:40.240
Jones. It's about Miranda, yes, but also there is a kind of

257
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emotional Catharsis whenever Miranda allows Spock to
bond with Colos, the Meduicin Ambassador,

258
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because she is dealing with jealousy and
the complex, complex emotions they are in.

259
00:23:00.000 --> 00:23:03.519
But she doesn't, the only reason
she allows him to is because the

260
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Meduicin Ambassador is basically like, you
gotta So at that point she still hasn't.

261
00:23:11.319 --> 00:23:17.480
That's true. She goes into the
UH Ambassador's quarters scream. You hear

262
00:23:17.559 --> 00:23:21.279
a scream. Then she says,
I guess I have basically have no choice.

263
00:23:22.119 --> 00:23:25.799
Okay, I like to like imagine
what was going on behind the door,

264
00:23:26.799 --> 00:23:33.000
Like, because let's establish the Meduicin
Ambassador. A great invention for Star

265
00:23:33.039 --> 00:23:36.599
Trek comes back in Star Trek Prodigy
because we've got a Meduce and crew member

266
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now, which is so good.
So I didn't understand, Yeah, I

267
00:23:41.599 --> 00:23:47.039
didn't understand until this, yeah,
which is because yeah, you never meet

268
00:23:47.039 --> 00:23:49.480
the Medicins again until Star Trek Prodigy. Like, watching this, I was

269
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genuinely like, where have I heard
this before? Where I oh, my

270
00:23:53.720 --> 00:23:59.559
gosh, Star Trek Prodigy spoiler A
great show, fantastic show. What a

271
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Star Wars was Star Trek And I'm
like, yeah, here for it because

272
00:24:02.960 --> 00:24:07.680
it's completely itself. I love it. Anyways, the Maduce and Ambassador is

273
00:24:07.759 --> 00:24:11.640
kind of you can speak more to
this, but it's echoing to some sort

274
00:24:11.680 --> 00:24:18.720
of love crafty and horrors exactly what
I said. It's exactly the episode started,

275
00:24:18.839 --> 00:24:21.599
and like everything was being described and
I was like, love Craft,

276
00:24:21.599 --> 00:24:26.119
shit, love this, love this, yes, yeah, but it's not

277
00:24:26.240 --> 00:24:33.160
Lovecraft. The author of this episode, as you said, it was a

278
00:24:33.200 --> 00:24:41.960
librarian, was extremely academic, and
originally the ambassador's name was Ariel, and

279
00:24:42.119 --> 00:24:48.400
the medusas was a gorgon of female
monster and Miranda and Ariel or the names

280
00:24:48.440 --> 00:24:52.880
of used by William Shakespeare for a
pair of characters in his play The Tempest.

281
00:24:52.920 --> 00:24:55.400
Miranda, the beautiful daughter of a
duke, an Ariel, a spirit

282
00:24:55.480 --> 00:24:59.680
charged with creating a means to help
navigate a ship carrying Miranda to safe harbor

283
00:25:00.720 --> 00:25:04.440
marriage. And yeah, the Tempest
is quoted in the episode, which was

284
00:25:04.720 --> 00:25:10.200
great. I believe, I believe
because it wasn't it. It wasn't a

285
00:25:10.240 --> 00:25:12.920
brave new world, wasn't no,
But I believe there was, like it

286
00:25:14.000 --> 00:25:22.559
was from the Tempist, but uh, I actually found because it was an

287
00:25:22.559 --> 00:25:29.599
episode so deeply focused on this person
who's not part of this main crew,

288
00:25:30.200 --> 00:25:37.319
her inner world, the perceptions of
her, Like there's this scene where so,

289
00:25:37.039 --> 00:25:41.160
oh gosh, it's such a good
episode. The description, so the

290
00:25:41.279 --> 00:25:45.160
NBC description is fine, it's obviously
more complicated in that for people who haven't

291
00:25:45.160 --> 00:25:48.920
seen this episode, and there's certainly
the action part as opposed to what this

292
00:25:48.960 --> 00:25:52.359
episode is, which is a character
study of an extremely complex woman. She's

293
00:25:52.400 --> 00:25:59.680
extremely complex. She uh she has
studied on Vulcan to be able to you

294
00:25:59.720 --> 00:26:03.480
know, she's a telepath literally born
a telepath. She studied on Vocan for

295
00:26:03.599 --> 00:26:07.880
like, for kind of emotional control. She is blind, and yet nobody

296
00:26:08.000 --> 00:26:12.960
knows it's not that aspect of it
is not introduced until like minute thirty five.

297
00:26:14.079 --> 00:26:18.960
It's very wild. They're at the
room of the MEDUSA ambassador. That's

298
00:26:18.160 --> 00:26:22.880
and McCoy brings it up and then
in look, Star Trek is not perfect

299
00:26:22.920 --> 00:26:30.160
and the camp aspect can very much
rear its head. So whenever they find

300
00:26:30.200 --> 00:26:37.839
out that she's blind, and then
Spock literally waves his hand and SIGs spot,

301
00:26:37.880 --> 00:26:42.240
come on, Spock, our logical, the smart apparently the smartest person

302
00:26:42.240 --> 00:26:48.960
in the galaxy. And also sometimes
you just gotta know it's the Star Trek

303
00:26:48.039 --> 00:26:56.799
is a perfect show, perfect franchise. Have no notes. She's she's being

304
00:26:56.720 --> 00:27:02.440
lusted after by this other guy.
The other guy. Every single person on

305
00:27:02.480 --> 00:27:08.359
the ship is like a going including
me I was on the ship, like

306
00:27:08.400 --> 00:27:15.559
I was watching it, and I
was like, this character is extraordinarily compelling,

307
00:27:15.839 --> 00:27:21.640
which is what I find hot,
like sort of the way that they

308
00:27:21.680 --> 00:27:26.319
describe her, their attraction her,
Like McCoy talks about it as like there's

309
00:27:26.319 --> 00:27:30.279
a vulnerability to her, and I
think we could dig into that right of,

310
00:27:30.319 --> 00:27:33.119
like ooh, women are attractive if
vulnerable, if weak, or if

311
00:27:33.160 --> 00:27:37.519
some you know, like we have
to protect or you know whatever. That

312
00:27:37.559 --> 00:27:42.240
looks like It was funny as a
viewer I did that was like he is

313
00:27:42.319 --> 00:27:45.240
hinting at the fact that what he
realizes later is that she's blind and that

314
00:27:45.279 --> 00:27:51.359
is a vulnerability. But I was
like the kind of the way that she

315
00:27:51.480 --> 00:27:57.319
held herself and the kind of power
she had was deeply attractive, this kind

316
00:27:57.359 --> 00:28:03.480
of like sense of self, and
I was like so taken by her,

317
00:28:04.319 --> 00:28:11.160
And yeah, I found like her
inner world to be so interesting and I

318
00:28:11.200 --> 00:28:17.279
took it my my my take.
I was thinking about this a little bit,

319
00:28:17.400 --> 00:28:22.400
like I think it is perfectly okay
for her to just be like I

320
00:28:22.480 --> 00:28:29.119
want to be able to the equivalent
of mind melds with this meducin for many

321
00:28:29.200 --> 00:28:33.240
reasons because of like the like how
extraordinary this would be like what are we

322
00:28:33.240 --> 00:28:37.640
doing? But I think a part
of me is was kind of like I

323
00:28:37.680 --> 00:28:41.240
think she might be in love with
the meducin, like, and that is

324
00:28:41.359 --> 00:28:47.839
great. It's so it's such a
complex dynamic, right because there are men

325
00:28:47.920 --> 00:28:55.279
being like by men. Captain Kirk
so completely violating kirkdrift, Come on,

326
00:28:56.640 --> 00:29:00.240
be with me, guy, because
Spock is like, I'll need a distraction

327
00:29:00.400 --> 00:29:03.839
in order to mind meut with them
to do so. And then Kirk I

328
00:29:03.839 --> 00:29:07.279
think, like the next shot is
like Kirk walking in just to douce Miranda,

329
00:29:07.759 --> 00:29:15.240
which is so funny. But anyways, Kirk and other men being like,

330
00:29:15.519 --> 00:29:18.920
you'll want to be with a human
at some point, but Miranda is

331
00:29:19.000 --> 00:29:25.960
very much like no. I trained
on Vulcan to specifically get over the fact

332
00:29:26.039 --> 00:29:30.279
that I am reading thoughts all the
time. Yes, girl, but no

333
00:29:30.319 --> 00:29:33.839
one can pass, but no one
can under stand. But at the same

334
00:29:33.920 --> 00:29:40.400
time, there's like a little bit
of avoidance of connecting with humans. Yes,

335
00:29:40.559 --> 00:29:44.599
man, what a great character.
Yes, Like she's clearly been flooded

336
00:29:44.640 --> 00:29:48.960
her entire life by everybody else's thoughts
and feelings. Yeah, uh went out

337
00:29:49.079 --> 00:29:53.960
like was purposely like I gotta put
up the strongest of boundaries, and I

338
00:29:55.000 --> 00:29:59.480
think you can kind of read it
as well. Maybe she Yeah, She's

339
00:29:59.519 --> 00:30:06.000
like, I don't want to like
manage this, but maybe like so this

340
00:30:06.880 --> 00:30:10.480
I'm gonna call it a traction,
but it's obviously far more than that.

341
00:30:10.559 --> 00:30:14.720
To this medicine and this like wanting
to have this connection is like it's it's

342
00:30:14.759 --> 00:30:21.920
intellectual and much safer. Uh,
well, it's probably like I think if

343
00:30:22.079 --> 00:30:30.160
if Rod's yeah rotten Berry was more
present, ah, he would double down

344
00:30:30.160 --> 00:30:37.200
on the sexual aspects on it and
also make Miranda just straight up a worse

345
00:30:37.359 --> 00:30:41.359
character. But Roddenberry had other things
that he wanted to do in this episode.

346
00:30:44.799 --> 00:30:48.039
What else did he do? What
did he do? So you're familiar

347
00:30:48.559 --> 00:30:55.599
with now you're familiar with the new
Pendant, the itdict? Oh because yeah,

348
00:30:55.759 --> 00:31:00.400
yeah, yeah, Spock was was
wearing that you know, that great

349
00:31:00.440 --> 00:31:07.000
vulcan thing. Yeah that I before. Yeah, well, but everyone acted

350
00:31:07.039 --> 00:31:10.000
like I was supposed to know what
he was talking about. Yeah, because

351
00:31:10.000 --> 00:31:12.640
Miranda's just like, are you wearing
that too? Point out the fact that

352
00:31:12.680 --> 00:31:15.960
I could never connect like you,
which I was like, oh my god,

353
00:31:17.200 --> 00:31:21.519
I love this jealous bitch. I'm
having a great vie. So in

354
00:31:21.559 --> 00:31:25.039
the contextualizing from these are the boy
just using the three by Mark Cushman and

355
00:31:25.119 --> 00:31:30.160
uh Susan Osborne? Is that?
Greg? I want to give credit appropriately.

356
00:31:32.400 --> 00:31:37.000
You've been reading this book for a
month. Look sometimes, did you

357
00:31:37.119 --> 00:31:41.319
just this is her first time calling
out the first time calling out Susan?

358
00:31:41.799 --> 00:31:48.279
Yeah, it truly is. I'm
doing a bad job Mark Cushman with Susan

359
00:31:48.319 --> 00:31:57.079
Osbourne. I can't believe I'm doing
a podcast with a sexist. That's right,

360
00:32:00.359 --> 00:32:07.359
but no one is sexist speaking of
sexist Geen Roddenberry, as I said

361
00:32:07.400 --> 00:32:13.039
before, and at least the context
is being presented. Roden Berry is basically

362
00:32:13.640 --> 00:32:17.920
checked out, but at the same
time present enough to make problems on the

363
00:32:17.960 --> 00:32:22.359
set because he still got an ego, case in point, in the itdict,

364
00:32:22.079 --> 00:32:28.839
because he's starting to ramp up the
merchandising arm of Star trek Okay,

365
00:32:29.359 --> 00:32:37.799
and so he writes in this pendant
with the intent, and everyone in the

366
00:32:37.880 --> 00:32:42.799
cast is like and by everyone,
I believe it's just Nimoy and Shatner who

367
00:32:42.799 --> 00:32:45.839
are like, this feels like you're
gonna sell this because you're just kind of

368
00:32:46.240 --> 00:32:50.160
talking about this thing that we've never
seen before. Is there any way that

369
00:32:50.160 --> 00:32:53.519
you could address that goes back to
Gene Roddenberry, and then the rewrites come

370
00:32:53.559 --> 00:33:04.079
back and it's actually longer. But
I also have to respect it. And

371
00:33:04.319 --> 00:33:08.839
it becomes enough of a fight between
Shattner, Nimoy and Roddenberry that Shattnay or

372
00:33:08.920 --> 00:33:15.640
Nimoy walk for the day. Like
it stops production on their stuff. They

373
00:33:15.640 --> 00:33:21.559
have to scramble to find stuff to
shoot. At some point they're coaxed backs

374
00:33:21.720 --> 00:33:25.880
to set and there is some sort
of compromise that is written that is made.

375
00:33:29.240 --> 00:33:32.799
There's a specific line from Ralph Sininski
where he's like, thank goodness,

376
00:33:32.880 --> 00:33:37.440
the actors knew their characters well enough
to kind of write their own lines.

377
00:33:37.559 --> 00:33:42.920
Oh my gosh, it's so weird. Just real quick, both of them

378
00:33:43.039 --> 00:33:51.680
left. Do we think their frustration
with Roddenberry was enough to bond them and

379
00:33:51.720 --> 00:33:54.920
make them forget about their own frustration
with each other? I mean their relationship

380
00:33:54.960 --> 00:34:04.000
is so complex. Uh three tickets
to two. I mean, yeah,

381
00:34:04.039 --> 00:34:08.599
it's this weird friendship that kind of
develops because they have to be friends because

382
00:34:08.639 --> 00:34:13.920
they're pop culture icons. Even if
you don't know Star Trek, I think

383
00:34:13.960 --> 00:34:20.079
you know Kirk and Spock. And
so they walk and then sure enough.

384
00:34:20.199 --> 00:34:24.119
Like eight or nine months later,
in Star Trek magazine, Geene Roddenberry is

385
00:34:24.920 --> 00:34:31.440
selling The Inexpendent and it like they
were They were absolutely right, because the

386
00:34:31.440 --> 00:34:37.320
copy is like featured in this episode. Here, buy it for six dollars

387
00:34:37.400 --> 00:34:43.840
or something along those lines. Wow. So he was so distracted with his

388
00:34:43.920 --> 00:34:50.320
potential merchandising that he didn't even he
didn't even get to like do his favorite

389
00:34:50.320 --> 00:34:58.079
thing, Like that's commitment. He's
checked out enough not to let the show

390
00:34:58.119 --> 00:35:00.840
go down. And by his favorite
thing, I mean putting women in terrible

391
00:35:00.880 --> 00:35:07.960
positions. Oh yeah? Uh.
Also Diana maldar is cast. Yes,

392
00:35:08.159 --> 00:35:12.440
doctor Miranda Jones, you remember her? I do remember her. I was

393
00:35:12.480 --> 00:35:15.639
like, where have I seen her
before? From the episode with Tomorrow,

394
00:35:15.840 --> 00:35:21.039
Yeah, episode I really liked.
Yeah, I liked her in that too.

395
00:35:21.719 --> 00:35:24.159
But you dye your hair dark,
give her a nice dark wig,

396
00:35:24.199 --> 00:35:32.920
and you're like, hmm that you
know who was originally gonna be Jessica Walter.

397
00:35:34.719 --> 00:35:38.599
Jessica Walter. Jessica Walter. You
definitely know her. I know Jessica

398
00:35:38.679 --> 00:35:43.440
Walter. Why can't I remember who
Jessica Walter is. I'm gonna let you

399
00:35:43.440 --> 00:35:49.480
look it up so you can be
just go Walter arrested development dress goal,

400
00:35:49.639 --> 00:35:53.440
Walter go see a Star Trek.
How much could it be? I don't

401
00:35:53.480 --> 00:36:06.360
much care for bones? How much
could I at B ten dollars? Oh

402
00:36:06.440 --> 00:36:12.199
my gosh, that's fun. What
happened? She's busy, well because she

403
00:36:10.920 --> 00:36:15.000
she got another job because she was
very in demand at that point. That

404
00:36:15.159 --> 00:36:19.760
is that's the end of my own
lady. And then yeah, Jessica Walter's

405
00:36:19.840 --> 00:36:27.159
fun. But Diana maldar has is
just like screaming, oh my, I

406
00:36:27.199 --> 00:36:34.000
am in command, and yet there's
a vulnerability like she's she's a half a

407
00:36:34.039 --> 00:36:38.719
man in jar Jo. Yeah,
while also being hurt. Yes, it's

408
00:36:38.760 --> 00:36:43.039
an extraordinary performance. The more that
we talk about it, just the better

409
00:36:43.079 --> 00:36:45.000
that it gets in my mind.
It's it's pretty extraordinary, And I think

410
00:36:45.000 --> 00:36:50.199
it helps contextually with the rest of
the show, because the show purports to

411
00:36:50.199 --> 00:36:57.039
be this feminist masterpiece and yet at
the same time it's been pretty simple.

412
00:36:57.159 --> 00:37:01.360
And I dare say, like,
this is the best h a character portrayed

413
00:37:01.360 --> 00:37:06.519
by a woman that we've gotten in
a while. In a while, because

414
00:37:06.800 --> 00:37:15.199
sitting on the edge of forever pretty
good. I would say the Romulin Commander

415
00:37:15.599 --> 00:37:22.000
closet this yeh yeah, great character
this has been. This was one of

416
00:37:22.119 --> 00:37:27.559
like I was just like dang dang
girl, which makes which is why I

417
00:37:27.719 --> 00:37:35.239
do believe that the end of it
is necessary, because I think that hurt

418
00:37:35.280 --> 00:37:40.559
is so profound because if she's so
she wants so deeply to connect with this,

419
00:37:40.719 --> 00:37:45.840
with this meducin ambassador so deeply for
whatever reason, whether it is romantic,

420
00:37:46.239 --> 00:37:51.119
intellectual, both, whatever it might
be to see someone be able to

421
00:37:51.159 --> 00:37:58.880
so easily do so and to also
be able to know how to so easily

422
00:37:58.880 --> 00:38:02.639
shut himself off to keep himself safe
when I can only assume, I mean,

423
00:38:02.960 --> 00:38:07.840
don't have to assume, she says
it like you can only like for

424
00:38:07.000 --> 00:38:12.599
years, probably just to be so
flooded by other people, Like she's just

425
00:38:13.320 --> 00:38:15.960
jealous of Spot, like not just
his connection, but like everything about him.

426
00:38:16.400 --> 00:38:22.559
And so when he he goes mad
because he forgets his advisor, which

427
00:38:22.800 --> 00:38:29.559
worked for me because actually in the
moment was like your advice, I forgot.

428
00:38:29.920 --> 00:38:32.039
He's like you forgot and then happened. I was like, no,

429
00:38:35.920 --> 00:38:38.679
for her to like kind of get
into his mind, connect with him,

430
00:38:38.719 --> 00:38:44.039
to bring him back, but it
was like she was like holding back because

431
00:38:44.079 --> 00:38:45.960
of that jealousy, I think,
and then to be like no, I

432
00:38:46.000 --> 00:38:49.679
can do this, I need to
do this, like I am more than

433
00:38:49.719 --> 00:38:52.599
this. Jealousy is actually a think
powerful move. And then she is able

434
00:38:52.719 --> 00:38:55.519
to connect with the ambassador, which
is great. And then she's like,

435
00:38:55.559 --> 00:39:02.559
well go bye bye bye. I'm
meaning and everyone's like, well what a

436
00:39:02.639 --> 00:39:07.599
woman, and they're like, okay, I agree. Anyway, let's me

437
00:39:07.719 --> 00:39:17.599
summary. I was just like one
speaking of surprising emotional complexities rookies. Dude.

438
00:39:19.320 --> 00:39:25.199
So beforehand, all the way up
until this episode, troopers have been

439
00:39:27.119 --> 00:39:34.480
dudes. We've just been They've just
been either completely silent or have you seen

440
00:39:34.519 --> 00:39:42.159
the new TC sixteen or just kind
of dudes. The first episode there they

441
00:39:42.199 --> 00:39:45.400
do have individuality, and I think
it is doing that on purpose. Oh

442
00:39:45.480 --> 00:39:50.679
yeah, that's true, because Yoda's
specifically calling it out. But it's still

443
00:39:51.000 --> 00:39:55.920
a little two dimensional. You like
this, you like this like and you're

444
00:39:55.960 --> 00:39:59.880
like okay, yeah, sure,
like this is good, but they're like,

445
00:40:00.039 --> 00:40:04.559
yes, they're just scars. Yeah, so not to like contract you.

446
00:40:04.639 --> 00:40:07.599
I agree with you. This does
feel like truly the first one where

447
00:40:07.639 --> 00:40:10.599
it really is like, these are
fully fleshed out people that we give a

448
00:40:10.639 --> 00:40:15.199
shit about and these aren't just dudes. Yeah, these are care recters.

449
00:40:15.559 --> 00:40:21.880
Yes, characters. Well we don't
necessarily know this, but I do.

450
00:40:22.639 --> 00:40:25.639
Well yeah, yeah, but it's
a mission statement, being like you got

451
00:40:25.639 --> 00:40:29.760
to feel something for these folks.
You're never going to look at these folks

452
00:40:29.800 --> 00:40:38.239
the same way again. Yeah,
absolutely, this is the full like force

453
00:40:38.559 --> 00:40:45.880
of the Cody Rex introductions two.
As I recall, we met Rex in

454
00:40:45.920 --> 00:40:52.599
the movie because Rex like meets Ahsoka, but this is like your first time

455
00:40:52.639 --> 00:40:59.199
getting to see and I only know
that Rex is in the moving truly through

456
00:40:59.280 --> 00:41:07.320
just research, because you had Anakin
Ahsoka, yeah, assage and his name

457
00:41:07.360 --> 00:41:12.440
was going to be Alpha, and
Lucas was like there's too many A names.

458
00:41:12.679 --> 00:41:16.239
Yeah, go with Rex Rex.
Yeah, and he doesn't really register

459
00:41:16.440 --> 00:41:21.039
that much as opposed to Soldier.
No. They have that one interchange in

460
00:41:21.079 --> 00:41:23.920
the Hangar where Ahsoka says, technically
I outrank you, right, and he's

461
00:41:24.000 --> 00:41:28.199
just like, well, okay,
buddy, and he says that, he

462
00:41:28.239 --> 00:41:31.960
says okay, grand body, and
I was like, this feels oddly informal.

463
00:41:34.519 --> 00:41:37.480
Yeah, he was just like okay, she walked away. He was

464
00:41:37.519 --> 00:41:42.679
just like fuck you, Yeah,
I needed to double deuces. Yeah,

465
00:41:42.800 --> 00:41:52.000
it was just like oh need you
classic go Soka, Rex relations, classic

466
00:41:52.039 --> 00:41:57.079
soldier behavior. AHA's like we got
to move forward to get the collective flank.

467
00:41:57.159 --> 00:42:00.800
And then Rex is like, you're
not my mom. I don't.

468
00:42:00.880 --> 00:42:07.760
I don't wink you. Yeah,
she's I'm gonna go to my room,

469
00:42:07.840 --> 00:42:19.480
little play my music. Listen to
Republic radio. They are just pretty disturbing.

470
00:42:20.119 --> 00:42:23.119
There's Republic radio. No, not
the fact that there is Republic radio.

471
00:42:23.119 --> 00:42:27.440
That's good world building because we're flushing
out what the Star Wars world is

472
00:42:27.480 --> 00:42:31.840
now that we're living in it more
than uh, you walk the droids.

473
00:42:34.199 --> 00:42:39.880
But the lady doesn't have eyes.
She's a droid, right, But she

474
00:42:39.880 --> 00:42:45.360
doesn't have eyes. She's she's got
bulbs. She does have bulbs. They

475
00:42:45.400 --> 00:42:49.960
look weird. But I, okay, why am I being contrary? Like,

476
00:42:49.960 --> 00:42:52.719
why am I being so contrary to
you? Because right, she looks

477
00:42:52.719 --> 00:42:55.880
weird. No, I think you're
right. She doesn't look weird. I

478
00:42:55.920 --> 00:43:00.400
think you're crazy. No, I
think you're crazy. I think you right,

479
00:43:00.599 --> 00:43:05.320
she doesn't look weird. You're crazy. Stop feeling things about character,

480
00:43:05.400 --> 00:43:09.280
DESI stop it. Why would you
feel that way? No, she does

481
00:43:09.320 --> 00:43:13.760
like a little spook. Spook,
she does. You're right, she looks

482
00:43:13.760 --> 00:43:16.000
so weird and you're like, it
has this sort of yeah, it's very

483
00:43:16.000 --> 00:43:22.079
like uncanny kind of thing, which
makes sense considering that it's another pipe of

484
00:43:22.119 --> 00:43:24.519
propaganda. Yeah. Actually, you
know what she reminded me of. Do

485
00:43:24.639 --> 00:43:29.840
you remember in Blade Runner twenty forty
nine, when giant an a day Armis

486
00:43:29.880 --> 00:43:32.639
just has like dark like black eyes, like she doesn't have that. That's

487
00:43:32.679 --> 00:43:37.559
like what reminded me of, but
smaller and just white. So that makes

488
00:43:37.559 --> 00:43:44.760
sense creepy because that character is also
manipulating yep, yep. Yeah. Anyways,

489
00:43:44.840 --> 00:43:46.920
rookies. Well, yeah, so
I only clocked Rex in the movie

490
00:43:46.920 --> 00:43:51.639
because I love Rex is one of
my favorite characters, and I was just

491
00:43:51.679 --> 00:43:53.280
like, oh, this is when
Rex first shows up. This is the

492
00:43:53.320 --> 00:43:57.840
episode where he and Cody do their
shit, and you see the way they

493
00:43:57.840 --> 00:44:01.639
interact with soldiers who are below them
in ranks. You can see how like

494
00:44:01.679 --> 00:44:05.559
he's got this kind of like cocky
side to him. He like knows how

495
00:44:05.559 --> 00:44:08.360
capable he is. They've got these
different very specific character designs. They you

496
00:44:08.360 --> 00:44:12.519
know, he's got what it was
part of his battalion, but like you

497
00:44:12.559 --> 00:44:15.760
know, his helmet blue. I
think he ends up like later you can

498
00:44:15.760 --> 00:44:19.519
see that he's got little scratches for
you know, like droys and stuff he's

499
00:44:19.559 --> 00:44:24.800
killed, and so specifically that the
Cody in Rex pieces great and those are

500
00:44:24.800 --> 00:44:28.519
going to be characters that you know, we we know about. You know,

501
00:44:28.639 --> 00:44:34.000
Cody is he's orders sixty six,
right, it's like what he wants

502
00:44:34.039 --> 00:44:37.840
talking to Cody and then he turns
around and shoots, you know the kind

503
00:44:37.880 --> 00:44:43.320
of thing. So we know who
Commander Cody is. Uh, the other

504
00:44:43.960 --> 00:44:49.719
the other uh, the other clones. I won't spoil anything for you,

505
00:44:51.280 --> 00:44:57.239
but oh they come back up.
I mean, what's happening. Wow,

506
00:44:57.639 --> 00:45:10.920
look here's a little puffin. Oh
okay, puffin. Yeah, obviously not

507
00:45:10.960 --> 00:45:17.159
the one who died two who died
not this well I Folani might bring it

508
00:45:17.239 --> 00:45:22.599
back in Ahsoka season two. Well
this is yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

509
00:45:22.679 --> 00:45:27.119
So there's a couple of there's a
couple of characters that, yeah, are

510
00:45:27.320 --> 00:45:30.360
actually significant. Like it's not like
they're in every episode or anything, but

511
00:45:30.360 --> 00:45:36.159
they literally are significant characters in the
show. And it is wonderful that you're

512
00:45:36.199 --> 00:45:40.599
like the first time truly seeing them
as rookies. I mean, I don't

513
00:45:40.599 --> 00:45:44.599
want to like this will take forever
to get to it, but like have

514
00:45:44.719 --> 00:45:47.400
you seen Have you seen bad Batch, because they're I don't know if you

515
00:45:47.400 --> 00:45:54.280
know this, kiddy, they're a
batch? What that's bad? No?

516
00:45:54.280 --> 00:46:00.440
No, no, not Stormtroopers.
No, not the Stormtroopers clubs. Please

517
00:46:00.840 --> 00:46:07.760
please tell me that that it doesn't
become like a war. Oh it's a

518
00:46:07.840 --> 00:46:15.280
war. No again, it's like
poetry. So rhy did you ever watch

519
00:46:15.280 --> 00:46:20.440
a bad Patch? I watched the
first episode or two, because remember we

520
00:46:20.519 --> 00:46:22.800
covered it whenever the Patreon was different. Oh yeah, when we were like,

521
00:46:22.840 --> 00:46:25.679
wow, we're doing a lot of
work. Yeah, and so we

522
00:46:27.800 --> 00:46:30.719
did less work. Well, we
still do a lot of work, but

523
00:46:30.800 --> 00:46:36.880
it's different. It's less time consuming, which is good because we get tired.

524
00:46:36.920 --> 00:46:39.039
Anyways, I don't know. I
mean, I'm like, should I

525
00:46:39.079 --> 00:46:44.679
spoil us for you or not?
Okay, okay, don't do it.

526
00:46:44.960 --> 00:46:47.679
But I mean, yeah, yeah
yeah, so, I mean it's it's

527
00:46:47.719 --> 00:46:52.800
great just the characters. These are
characters that will stick around and are important

528
00:46:52.960 --> 00:46:59.960
and that is cool, very cool, just like just like Droids, exactly

529
00:47:00.199 --> 00:47:07.480
like Droid's very serialized. Skim it
it bing bop, It's going to come

530
00:47:07.480 --> 00:47:16.719
back. I forgot slappity on face. Mungo bingo bam bam that's right.

531
00:47:17.760 --> 00:47:24.360
Bilbo bab bab. He's gotta come
back. He's gonna come back. You're

532
00:47:24.360 --> 00:47:31.199
gonna see him again. Totally a
memorable guy. Dongo Bilspean, Yeah,

533
00:47:32.960 --> 00:47:55.400
Stable Yan spin Ram Milemma, Dang
Georgian Taflon Craig Yeah. Wait wait wait,

534
00:47:55.440 --> 00:48:00.000
what was the name of the guy
from uh that we love from?

535
00:48:00.800 --> 00:48:06.119
Larry? Larry. Yeah, we've
got Larry in this week's Star Trek episode,

536
00:48:06.119 --> 00:48:10.239
which is great. Larry. Oh
my gosh, he's the he's the

537
00:48:10.239 --> 00:48:14.760
guy who's in love with her Branda. Yeah, and also helped design the

538
00:48:14.840 --> 00:48:22.480
enterprise. Also help design the enterprise. Larry is a jerk. Yeah,

539
00:48:22.800 --> 00:48:27.639
yeah, I would say a murderous
jerk. Yeah, murder unlike the other

540
00:48:27.719 --> 00:48:30.239
good Larry from Ewoks, who was
great, good Larry, good Larry.

541
00:48:30.480 --> 00:48:35.760
We ship Larry in the community,
we do. That was my ship anyway.

542
00:48:36.039 --> 00:48:37.719
No, we're just no, we're
just talking. I think this episode

543
00:48:37.719 --> 00:48:46.000
is great, say more, Uh
it is again thematics through action, talking

544
00:48:46.039 --> 00:48:53.840
about we got collective victories here,
teaming up, recognizing that they can't do

545
00:48:53.960 --> 00:49:00.559
all of this by themselves, recognizing
the experiences earn. It's not respect is

546
00:49:00.840 --> 00:49:08.760
earned. Rather, it's not just
given how you handle yourself. It's it's

547
00:49:08.760 --> 00:49:14.519
a it's a fun rip. We're
in action pus. We see a droids,

548
00:49:14.880 --> 00:49:21.639
we see commando droids. Yeah,
which the team described as a hybrid

549
00:49:21.760 --> 00:49:28.239
of the kind of regular Roger Roger
battle droids and those B series droids the

550
00:49:28.280 --> 00:49:32.280
big dudes, not the droid eck
is the big big girls. Yes,

551
00:49:34.239 --> 00:49:40.280
Uh, I mean the Star Trek
episode is obviously a little bit more thematically

552
00:49:40.320 --> 00:49:45.000
rich to talk about because there's a
lot more complexities as opposed to rookies,

553
00:49:45.039 --> 00:49:49.880
where we're just meeting the characters and
we are seeing character through action and we

554
00:49:49.920 --> 00:49:54.079
are seeing set pieces that rule.
We get a big honkin worm, big

555
00:49:54.159 --> 00:50:00.679
honkin heel worm fight. It's got
it's got a mouth, it's got like

556
00:50:00.760 --> 00:50:05.440
it's like little chompers on either side
and it goes from either side, like

557
00:50:07.320 --> 00:50:12.159
and it just eats that too.
Yeah. They in a moment that's literally

558
00:50:12.199 --> 00:50:14.920
like watch out for the eels and
they'll just comes out of one of these

559
00:50:15.119 --> 00:50:19.920
giant holes on this moon. Sorry
I'm like interrupting you, but I really

560
00:50:19.920 --> 00:50:22.800
love that at least because I think
that you have more to say about rookies

561
00:50:22.840 --> 00:50:29.400
than I do. Oh just uh
what else is there to say about this

562
00:50:29.400 --> 00:50:32.079
episode outside of just it's a it's
a good time you're and also you're just

563
00:50:34.960 --> 00:50:39.599
meeting it's seeing the clones more as
people. Yeah, like there's a little

564
00:50:39.639 --> 00:50:45.360
touches dimensional people. There's little touches. They talk about this and the floony

565
00:50:45.440 --> 00:50:51.119
zone and in the future at of
like they have things like pit ups on

566
00:50:51.159 --> 00:50:53.159
the wall. They got like an
artist to do, like, which is

567
00:50:53.360 --> 00:50:59.599
is fun. Like the very the
idea indicates that clones would have a sex

568
00:50:59.679 --> 00:51:04.320
drive, right, I mean,
why not unless they're just like we love

569
00:51:04.400 --> 00:51:10.320
lot, we love women pin up. That's how ought. There's an it's

570
00:51:12.679 --> 00:51:15.960
very good thought because it's like,
wait, what's the implication of this,

571
00:51:15.079 --> 00:51:19.800
which is like, yeah, we're
into these sexy ladies, like are we?

572
00:51:19.840 --> 00:51:23.320
Which, of course there's would absolutely
be no like exploration of like sex

573
00:51:23.440 --> 00:51:28.199
drive with these characters not in Star
Wars. If it was Star Trek,

574
00:51:28.239 --> 00:51:31.760
they'd be like, let's double down
right for sure, which is yeah,

575
00:51:31.960 --> 00:51:36.159
and obviously they're not going to do
it. Clones are born horny, oh

576
00:51:36.199 --> 00:51:42.800
my god. But so I think
it's like it's really good like in text

577
00:51:42.920 --> 00:51:45.840
like textual like thing to be like
wait, what's the implication of this I

578
00:51:45.920 --> 00:51:49.840
like it. That is just like
we just really like art. She looks

579
00:51:49.880 --> 00:51:58.519
like a good soldier. But because
obviously we luck well lock that's as but

580
00:51:58.559 --> 00:52:05.639
now it's just we lock. We
lack good soldier soldiers. We lock everyone.

581
00:52:05.679 --> 00:52:12.239
He's everyone's he's straight, and in
terms of like being square, we're

582
00:52:12.280 --> 00:52:15.760
all straight. Everyone's straight here.
How are you? What good? How

583
00:52:15.840 --> 00:52:21.880
are you? There's a touch of
that joke that sort of called back to

584
00:52:22.440 --> 00:52:25.159
Star Wars New Hope, with like
like one of the Commando droids puts on

585
00:52:25.719 --> 00:52:32.199
the armor, which is very uh
great, wonderful great, and also very

586
00:52:32.199 --> 00:52:36.400
grulish, and they kind of do
this thing where they like try to like

587
00:52:36.880 --> 00:52:39.840
try to convince them that it's them. They try to convince Cody and Rex,

588
00:52:39.880 --> 00:52:43.519
and they do the kind of like
consolo thing where they're like, everything's

589
00:52:43.519 --> 00:52:47.719
great here, how are you?
It's really funny to me because I always

590
00:52:47.760 --> 00:52:53.480
will find that funny. This entire
show, I mean, not the entire

591
00:52:53.480 --> 00:53:00.559
show, obviously, the entire The
entire entire show is one day cartoon beg

592
00:53:00.920 --> 00:53:09.400
uh Feast for the Eyes, one
one big cartoon network. Different things happen,

593
00:53:09.440 --> 00:53:15.079
but it's obviously called the Clone Wars, so you know, by by

594
00:53:15.199 --> 00:53:17.079
name alone, we can assume it
is about the battles, right, and

595
00:53:17.119 --> 00:53:23.800
it's all about these clones, and
so more than anything, it's probably drawing

596
00:53:24.000 --> 00:53:30.039
like like, I don't know what
am I trying to say? Great question.

597
00:53:31.000 --> 00:53:35.000
Did you know I did a night
swim last night? Oh my gosh,

598
00:53:35.000 --> 00:53:37.960
what does that have to do?
He's so tire. I'm so tired.

599
00:53:38.920 --> 00:53:45.159
I don't know how interested I am
in military stories. Yes, I

600
00:53:45.199 --> 00:53:50.639
don't really know it that I am, and yet I am happily consuming this.

601
00:53:51.119 --> 00:53:53.800
You love the clones. I love
them, and I love this idea

602
00:53:54.360 --> 00:53:58.960
of us. Just like looking at
these dudes who have just been posted here,

603
00:53:59.079 --> 00:54:02.440
they're not really seeing any action.
They're just like bored out of their

604
00:54:02.599 --> 00:54:07.639
minds because they're just like, I
don't know there's another asteroid like shot like

605
00:54:07.719 --> 00:54:12.920
meteor shower. We're just looking at
shit. Even though it's an important job,

606
00:54:13.199 --> 00:54:15.719
it's not the action job, right, And there are like for sure

607
00:54:15.920 --> 00:54:21.599
like that is I you know what's
military esque, like some things are on

608
00:54:21.639 --> 00:54:25.599
the ground, some things aren't.
But I guess I guess what it does

609
00:54:25.679 --> 00:54:30.840
do is because we do know the
language of military like soldier stories. Right,

610
00:54:31.480 --> 00:54:36.920
And as we've talked about so many
times before, George Lucas and also

611
00:54:36.960 --> 00:54:40.760
Dave Filoni now dealing with aesthetics.
And I don't necessarily think that Dave Filoni

612
00:54:40.960 --> 00:54:45.599
is going to be like in order
to understand the clones, I went six

613
00:54:45.960 --> 00:54:50.920
months deep with training Navy seals.
No, you're gonna be dealing with aesthetics,

614
00:54:51.199 --> 00:54:53.159
right. It is the I mean
the pin ups, like the pictures

615
00:54:53.159 --> 00:54:57.159
on the wall. That's actually that's
perfect example of the aesthetics. Right.

616
00:54:57.199 --> 00:55:00.320
We're trying to like draw you to
the idea of like you've seen you've seen

617
00:55:00.320 --> 00:55:04.119
these films, you've seen it.
You like to mash, like I don't

618
00:55:04.480 --> 00:55:09.480
like you like to mash. So
uh. Actually, it does so much

619
00:55:09.519 --> 00:55:14.920
to humanize them because you're like there's
just like like they're like kids. It's

620
00:55:14.960 --> 00:55:16.440
like what it feels like, it
feels like kids at war. So when

621
00:55:16.480 --> 00:55:20.440
they do die, it feels really
awful, Like it feels really bad,

622
00:55:20.559 --> 00:55:22.559
just like these rookies, these kids, and they've got guys who come in

623
00:55:22.599 --> 00:55:27.639
that have more experience in them and
they're like helping them out and they're trying

624
00:55:27.679 --> 00:55:30.800
their best when they sacrifice, Like
when one of them sacrifices themselves. It

625
00:55:30.960 --> 00:55:36.480
truly feels like a sacrifice. So
yeah, but I think maybe the difference

626
00:55:36.480 --> 00:55:39.840
here is, Yeah, you were
using aesthetics to actually call forth real emotional

627
00:55:39.880 --> 00:55:45.000
depth. I think that's very interesting. The military aesthetics to call for emotional

628
00:55:45.119 --> 00:55:50.119
death depth is not quite something that
I thought I would be so into here

629
00:55:50.159 --> 00:55:58.800
we are, I mean using using
a using an aesthetic shorthand to get to

630
00:55:58.880 --> 00:56:02.840
the character parts quicker as opposed to
setting up kind of the language exactly and

631
00:56:02.880 --> 00:56:06.800
making a more precise thing. No, you just go with the broadstrukes because

632
00:56:06.800 --> 00:56:08.480
you want to get to the character
stuff first. Yeah, you want to

633
00:56:08.760 --> 00:56:13.000
really know how these like what matters, Like what do they care about?

634
00:56:13.000 --> 00:56:15.360
Who are they? And you know, they're making fun of each other,

635
00:56:15.679 --> 00:56:19.000
like well give me each other little
jabs, you know, and it's like,

636
00:56:19.159 --> 00:56:22.280
yeah, they've been here for a
while and now they're plays in a

637
00:56:22.360 --> 00:56:30.119
terrible situation. Are both of these
episodes just dealing with surprising complexities as in

638
00:56:30.199 --> 00:56:37.719
like our experience of it is that
they are surprising? Yeah, I think

639
00:56:37.760 --> 00:56:42.559
so. Outside of the fact that
both episodes, is there in truth no

640
00:56:42.639 --> 00:56:46.239
beauty, As I said at the
beginning of the episode, Bottle episode,

641
00:56:46.320 --> 00:56:51.239
all of it takes place on pre
existing sets, and then this episode of

642
00:56:51.280 --> 00:56:53.880
the Clone Wars they built the station
with a lot of these assets the same

643
00:56:54.159 --> 00:56:58.000
They talk about it in the Polony
Zone. Now I know what it means,

644
00:56:58.400 --> 00:57:02.280
yep, and they're talking about using
pre existing sets and then just being

645
00:57:02.320 --> 00:57:07.079
like, put a beard on this
guy. He's got a scar. What

646
00:57:07.119 --> 00:57:09.639
do you want? The boxes?
Love the boxes. The boxes are always

647
00:57:09.679 --> 00:57:15.920
the same. Well, and I
will say there is a complexity to the

648
00:57:15.920 --> 00:57:19.840
different clones. I think there's really
an extraordinary there's extraordinary work that they do.

649
00:57:21.119 --> 00:57:23.039
Yeah, there's a sergeant who's gray
hair, there's you see them.

650
00:57:23.320 --> 00:57:27.400
They look different, they have different
haircuts, they have different individualities, and

651
00:57:27.440 --> 00:57:30.880
then of course the Bradley Baker.
It does a really beautiful job of giving

652
00:57:30.880 --> 00:57:37.519
them all different tones, like different
ways that they speak, you know,

653
00:57:37.559 --> 00:57:40.639
they have you can tell the difference
between them, and that happened in those

654
00:57:40.639 --> 00:57:45.039
earlier episodes. I think it really
starts to come into play here and you

655
00:57:45.039 --> 00:57:46.599
can feel it even more profoundly.
I think it's just like it's kind of

656
00:57:46.599 --> 00:57:50.440
an extraordinary job, you know,
like to be able to do that.

657
00:57:52.679 --> 00:57:53.920
So yeah, maybe it is a
surprise. Do you come into it being

658
00:57:54.000 --> 00:57:57.400
like, Okay, we got another
Clone wars up. We've been doing some

659
00:57:57.440 --> 00:58:00.480
like crash crash through space, and
now we're like I am. I was

660
00:58:00.519 --> 00:58:05.239
crying. I was like devastated by
the episode. I'd seen it before,

661
00:58:05.400 --> 00:58:08.239
and it's just like heavy sacrificing himself
getting shot down and still got it,

662
00:58:08.280 --> 00:58:13.440
you know, like doing the arm
again. Thing like there's in doing it

663
00:58:13.480 --> 00:58:15.639
to like not just for what's right, but you know, also for each

664
00:58:15.679 --> 00:58:20.480
other. And that's that kind of
eflectivism. Yeah, I think, Yeah,

665
00:58:20.519 --> 00:58:22.239
from that perspective, that's sort of
like our experience of the thing.

666
00:58:22.440 --> 00:58:25.119
It was. They were like I
was, even though I've seen it before,

667
00:58:25.119 --> 00:58:28.039
I was surprised by both. I
was just like right, right,

668
00:58:28.159 --> 00:58:35.719
right right, you know, I
don't know, you know what I do

669
00:58:35.880 --> 00:58:43.800
know? What do you know?
Speaking of surprises A long time ago,

670
00:58:44.559 --> 00:58:49.480
start dating this week. I quoted
a boat. I dated a game,

671
00:58:50.119 --> 00:58:57.960
but none of them could warp mine
drive into hyper space. The best of

672
00:58:58.079 --> 00:59:07.760
both worlds can be in second place, Captain slog on a Halla Kron.

673
00:59:07.440 --> 00:59:13.679
I wanted a song. I pend
a song. Seventeen more minutes. A

674
00:59:13.880 --> 00:59:27.079
fies in Super High dev aboard the
USS Enterprise dt F. Don't you take

675
00:59:27.119 --> 00:59:31.280
my walk lighter and clip it.
Don't you take my Wretchord buddy and nip

676
00:59:31.360 --> 00:59:37.719
it. If you spill the tea, I'm gonna sip it. I starship

677
00:59:37.760 --> 00:59:42.039
it. That's when what are we
doing? I had your number that time.

678
00:59:42.159 --> 00:59:45.400
I knew that's what you were doing. I think that's what you're setting

679
00:59:45.440 --> 00:59:47.280
me up for. Okay, so
sorry that I'm worried about shape of show.

680
00:59:47.280 --> 00:59:55.320
You you're a ding don You're a
ding dong. No, before we

681
00:59:55.360 --> 01:00:00.719
talk about what we're doing right now, can you say that, yes permission?

682
01:00:01.199 --> 01:00:07.159
Headphones are hurting my ears, and
I I think I'm I think I'm

683
01:00:07.199 --> 01:00:20.679
just sensitive because of my night swim. I felt a lot of emotions in

684
01:00:20.760 --> 01:00:27.679
my life. This truly might be
the lowest. I think you're just jealous

685
01:00:27.719 --> 01:00:30.639
of my night swim. And if
I have any reason to go on,

686
01:00:31.719 --> 01:00:35.280
if I went mad, you wouldn't
pull me back because you're jealous of my

687
01:00:35.360 --> 01:00:39.400
night swim. Yeah, yeah,
I'm living. I wish that I could

688
01:00:39.440 --> 01:00:42.679
have gone on a night swim,
but no, I was land locked on

689
01:00:42.760 --> 01:00:52.199
dry land mad. It's a nightmare. I live in a nightmare. You

690
01:00:52.239 --> 01:00:58.320
know who doesn't live in a nightmare
starships? That's right? And romantic ships?

691
01:00:58.440 --> 01:01:00.400
Did I do as good of a
job of a szegue? Is you?

692
01:01:00.760 --> 01:01:05.119
Yeah? You did cool things?
Who doesn't live in a nightmare?

693
01:01:05.360 --> 01:01:09.039
Me? I had my next whim
Let's see what are we doing? Oh,

694
01:01:09.079 --> 01:01:15.719
we're gonna name our favorite ships that
fly for this guy zoom zoom zoom,

695
01:01:15.800 --> 01:01:20.639
zoom zoom zoom, and our favorite
romantic relationship ships. Mm hmm.

696
01:01:21.000 --> 01:01:24.840
Wait, you know we didn't talk
about no speaking of ships. I just

697
01:01:24.880 --> 01:01:28.199
thought, okay, let me just
let me just put this out here before

698
01:01:28.239 --> 01:01:30.199
we get into our thing. We
talked about how the writer of the Star

699
01:01:30.239 --> 01:01:35.760
Trek episode was a librarian, but
like this is it right? Like she's

700
01:01:35.800 --> 01:01:38.800
like only one of but like four
people that just like we're like, here's

701
01:01:38.800 --> 01:01:43.360
a script I wrote, you want
to do it? And they just did

702
01:01:43.400 --> 01:01:45.159
it. They were like, we
like it, let's do it. Like

703
01:01:45.400 --> 01:01:49.159
I don't. Did she write anything
after that or is she just like back

704
01:01:49.199 --> 01:01:54.280
to being a librarian at uc LA. She talked reading the book It's she

705
01:01:54.360 --> 01:01:58.760
talks about that she could only get
one day free in order to go to

706
01:01:59.239 --> 01:02:07.039
the set because she was still working
at the library. At Yeah, it

707
01:02:07.159 --> 01:02:12.679
was. It was in La University. I did not even though I literally

708
01:02:12.719 --> 01:02:15.119
read where her story was, I
did not highlight any of it for quick

709
01:02:15.199 --> 01:02:22.199
access. It's one of four writers
with no prior television writing credits David Gerald,

710
01:02:22.239 --> 01:02:28.119
GD Burns, and Joyce Mascot.
That's fascinating. Oh yeah, and

711
01:02:28.320 --> 01:02:34.119
no, she gets another episode later
down the line. Okay, cool,

712
01:02:34.440 --> 01:02:37.400
we're right. That's right. I
did read that. I just love that.

713
01:02:37.679 --> 01:02:39.480
She's just like, Okay. The
reason the reason I thought of that

714
01:02:39.559 --> 01:02:44.760
is because I was thinking about shipping
and fan fix and shipping and fan fix,

715
01:02:44.960 --> 01:02:49.760
and she only wrote two episodes of
Star Trek and that's it for her

716
01:02:49.800 --> 01:02:52.559
TV career. Yes, because she
was like, bitch, I'm a fanfake

717
01:02:52.599 --> 01:02:59.280
writer. She's a fanfic writer.
I love that. She is like living

718
01:02:59.280 --> 01:03:04.159
everybody's dream. She loved Star Trek. This I imagine her life. She

719
01:03:04.280 --> 01:03:07.519
was like, I love my job. I'm great at being a library because

720
01:03:07.559 --> 01:03:10.880
librarians are a badass. This is
fantastic. Whatever. I love this show.

721
01:03:10.920 --> 01:03:15.519
I'm going to write some thick about
it. And she is also a

722
01:03:15.800 --> 01:03:22.280
beneficiary because NBC gave Star Trek the
mandate to hire more women behind the scenes

723
01:03:22.760 --> 01:03:29.239
there you go right place, right
time to give an episode that feels more

724
01:03:29.320 --> 01:03:36.599
akin to the other two seasons.
Yeah, this was It's witty, unique,

725
01:03:37.159 --> 01:03:39.960
but we're not sorry. At the
end of the episode where we're ranking

726
01:03:39.960 --> 01:03:44.760
stuff, wow, where did I
starship it? But I bring it up

727
01:03:44.880 --> 01:03:51.440
there is connective tissue here because she's
the ultimate shipper, so I understand her

728
01:03:51.480 --> 01:03:58.559
emotionally and I am deeply proud.
But we'll start with starships. Do you

729
01:03:58.599 --> 01:04:03.480
want to be able to go for
yes, because I have a good ship,

730
01:04:04.000 --> 01:04:09.280
a relationship. Wait, start with
start with starship. Oh, start

731
01:04:09.280 --> 01:04:15.840
with starship, starty starship. We
always start We always start with stars Oh

732
01:04:15.880 --> 01:04:20.679
my gosh. So I think we
have to look this up if I if

733
01:04:20.679 --> 01:04:25.199
we've said this before, but have
we ever done this? Like the Republic

734
01:04:25.400 --> 01:04:31.639
Cruiser, Oh, just let me
check, just like the big old attack

735
01:04:31.719 --> 01:04:39.559
cruisers shut up from Sigma V ninety
to Republic hospital Ships, Tanty three,

736
01:04:39.679 --> 01:04:45.239
the Soulest One, the Woden genevc's
class start GENI Starlight Negatory. Yep,

737
01:04:45.400 --> 01:04:50.920
the Republic attack cruiser. A Republic
attack cruiser. Yeah, man, Like

738
01:04:51.119 --> 01:04:56.400
it's okay, that's so wild that
we haven't done it because it's they're in

739
01:04:56.480 --> 01:05:00.039
all of these right, they've been
throughout. I think what made me think

740
01:05:00.039 --> 01:05:06.480
about them this time was there's this
great moment where at the end of Rookies,

741
01:05:08.960 --> 01:05:13.079
the reason they have to blow up
the space is because so the separatists

742
01:05:13.119 --> 01:05:15.400
have taken it over, like the
droids. They have to skid out all

743
01:05:15.400 --> 01:05:20.079
out of there. The droids take
it over, which is bad news because

744
01:05:20.239 --> 01:05:24.280
then they can get through this whole
thing. So what they have to do

745
01:05:24.400 --> 01:05:27.719
is they get this idea to They're
like, well, if we can stop

746
01:05:27.800 --> 01:05:31.679
the signal from coming from it,
the Republic will know that something is wrong

747
01:05:32.000 --> 01:05:34.079
and they'll come to it. So
it's very clever. It's like so they

748
01:05:34.119 --> 01:05:39.400
blow it up and that whole thing
the moment and so like they've got Grieves

749
01:05:39.480 --> 01:05:45.440
being like, we will come down
there, what does happening? And then

750
01:05:45.519 --> 01:05:47.719
like the moment that signal goes out, the Republic's like what the fuck?

751
01:05:47.800 --> 01:05:54.519
And then they just right into like
shot yeah, and they're like right there

752
01:05:54.599 --> 01:05:57.920
and just like the shot of it, like you can see out the front

753
01:05:58.039 --> 01:06:01.440
from like Grieves as ship as they
all just do their little like light speed.

754
01:06:01.840 --> 01:06:05.119
I love them, and they'll just
come in. I'm just like,

755
01:06:05.440 --> 01:06:10.039
look at you. Those ships are
so beautiful, and that's what made me

756
01:06:10.079 --> 01:06:14.320
think of it. I just love
that they got that you know, distinctive

757
01:06:14.320 --> 01:06:23.400
republic read to them. They've got
that wild sort of like butt blug shape.

758
01:06:26.840 --> 01:06:38.519
Absolutely correct, yep, I love
them. You all go. Thank

759
01:06:38.559 --> 01:06:45.079
you so much for my starship.
I am picking the Medusan vessel from I

760
01:06:45.199 --> 01:06:51.320
believe the remastered version only is there
in truth, no beauty, Kenny,

761
01:06:51.880 --> 01:06:57.760
I don't recall seeing this in the
It's not because I watched the original,

762
01:06:57.800 --> 01:07:00.840
because you sent me the originals.
Oh fabulous. I meant to tell you

763
01:07:00.840 --> 01:07:03.800
that, Like I was like,
wow, this is my first time like

764
01:07:03.920 --> 01:07:09.000
seeing Oh, you've never seen any
of the original effects before unless it was

765
01:07:09.280 --> 01:07:12.800
I want, like fifteen years ago, and I just didn't cock it,

766
01:07:13.400 --> 01:07:16.280
dude. I loved it, right, it looks like it. I absolutely

767
01:07:16.400 --> 01:07:19.679
love it. I think it looks
better than the CG stuff, honestly,

768
01:07:19.800 --> 01:07:25.360
genuinely. So I didn't see I
don't I did not recall there being like

769
01:07:25.360 --> 01:07:28.960
a med Doucin ship. Yeah,
well, in the remastered version there is

770
01:07:28.960 --> 01:07:34.159
a Medusin ship and it is a
big honkin sphere with what looks like Enterprise

771
01:07:34.320 --> 01:07:42.639
engines on the side, I am
a basic fuselage. Uh. And it

772
01:07:42.800 --> 01:07:48.599
was newly designed, at least according
to Memory Alpha. It strongly resembles one

773
01:07:48.599 --> 01:07:54.639
of the early sketches that art director
Matt Jefferies drew the USS Enterprise, and

774
01:07:54.760 --> 01:08:00.840
that is that's so funny because as
soon as I saw a ship design,

775
01:08:00.920 --> 01:08:04.639
I'm like, wow, that just
looks like a discarded Matt Jefferies design.

776
01:08:04.679 --> 01:08:10.880
It follows the design ethos that he
carried into the series of only two to

777
01:08:10.960 --> 01:08:14.960
sells. You got a ball because
the Enterprise was originally going to be a

778
01:08:15.000 --> 01:08:17.760
ball instead of a saw. I
love that. It's sick. I love

779
01:08:17.800 --> 01:08:23.520
that. Don't hate that. Don't
hate that. That's great. That's fun.

780
01:08:23.560 --> 01:08:26.199
I'll go back in and look at
it. I can see it.

781
01:08:26.560 --> 01:08:30.640
Gosh, thank you so much for
reminding me of the induce and Connection and

782
01:08:30.840 --> 01:08:35.000
Prodigy. Oh that's right, it
was Little Prodigy. She's so good.

783
01:08:34.560 --> 01:08:39.720
I had it on the background while
I was working. I barreled through the

784
01:08:39.880 --> 01:08:43.279
entire season in one day, just
because I was working for so long.

785
01:08:44.359 --> 01:08:51.359
It was is Fa the main actor
in Fallout, the television program Fallout.

786
01:08:51.680 --> 01:08:59.840
She is the voice of Gwynn on
prodigy. I love that. I love

787
01:09:00.239 --> 01:09:06.479
relationships and ships. Yes, okay, can I take what feels like it's

788
01:09:06.520 --> 01:09:15.760
the obvious one? Absolutely? Uh, Miranda and the Medusain Ambassador Miranda and

789
01:09:15.800 --> 01:09:25.640
the MEDUSA Ambassador Colos Colos, Yes, I love it to genuinely whatever that

790
01:09:25.720 --> 01:09:29.159
relationship looks like, like that is
a canon thing and I ship it hard.

791
01:09:30.000 --> 01:09:40.199
Star Trek has coded romantic relationships as
being very archetypal. Man woman woman

792
01:09:40.399 --> 01:09:48.159
is mostly in distressor to your lower
status than man is Kirk. We're Captain

793
01:09:48.199 --> 01:09:54.880
Kirk type or in rare occasions spot
everyonce in a while Scotti. And this

794
01:09:54.960 --> 01:10:01.399
relationship is so much more than that. It is a deeper, deeper than

795
01:10:01.960 --> 01:10:06.760
the romantic love that we have seen
depicted on the show. Yeah. Even

796
01:10:06.760 --> 01:10:13.840
in the episode the Cloud Cloud,
the Love Love Cloud episode where like metamorphosis

797
01:10:13.920 --> 01:10:16.680
metamorphosis where she then like takes over
the body, like she has to take

798
01:10:16.720 --> 01:10:21.399
on woman shape for it to like
work. It makes sense, like it's

799
01:10:21.399 --> 01:10:25.479
like that has to look like what
you're saying, And so I think it's

800
01:10:26.079 --> 01:10:30.199
Miranda is attracted to Colos in a
way that is deeper than romantic love.

801
01:10:31.359 --> 01:10:38.680
We cannot understand, and it is
truly alien. I love it. It's

802
01:10:38.880 --> 01:10:44.199
I love it. I love it. The ship that I wrote down was

803
01:10:44.520 --> 01:10:53.359
McCoy and Miranda. Yeah, everyone, yeah, everyone is fawning over doctor

804
01:10:53.399 --> 01:10:59.800
Miranda Jones make no mistake, right, but McCoy in a way that he

805
01:11:00.199 --> 01:11:05.159
very rarely does. It's just like
welling eyes kind of coming out of his

806
01:11:05.159 --> 01:11:11.640
head and being like that. He
literally says that is a lady. Yeah

807
01:11:11.800 --> 01:11:16.640
he does. He does say that, And there is just something that is

808
01:11:16.720 --> 01:11:24.880
really lovely about watching that side.
It's not as opposed to Larry or Kirk,

809
01:11:25.359 --> 01:11:30.000
where uh gross and Miranda is just
like no, no, don't want

810
01:11:30.039 --> 01:11:33.119
this. We haven't even talked about
Larry, who well we barely talked about

811
01:11:33.199 --> 01:11:45.119
Larry, who just kind of goes
mad with love hardness. Yeah. He

812
01:11:45.279 --> 01:11:47.319
ends up looking at the produce and
ambassador because he's like, what does he

813
01:11:47.399 --> 01:11:56.359
have that I don't right answer space
madness and drives the Enterprise into the Great

814
01:11:56.399 --> 01:11:59.760
Barrier at the edge of the galaxy, third time, third time that they've

815
01:11:59.760 --> 01:12:03.199
been there. By the way,
he says something when he's like, after

816
01:12:03.279 --> 01:12:08.399
he's gone mad, what does he
say? Like it's like this accusation against

817
01:12:08.399 --> 01:12:12.960
her of like her like like playing
with your emotions or something like. And

818
01:12:13.000 --> 01:12:18.319
it's such a like she like she's
such a tease kind of vibe like and

819
01:12:18.359 --> 01:12:21.760
it's like she's clear, She's been
clear with you the whole She's said.

820
01:12:23.159 --> 01:12:26.880
She literally says, I've been clear
with my emotions. Yeah. She's like,

821
01:12:27.000 --> 01:12:31.039
I'm not into you, and you
are still doing this and I'm being

822
01:12:31.159 --> 01:12:36.960
nicer than I should be, which
is a classic experience. And he is

823
01:12:38.079 --> 01:12:44.680
like, I'm gonna go kill it. So McCoy just seems especially struck by

824
01:12:45.119 --> 01:12:48.960
Miranda, and it's just like,
I would love to be a gentleman right

825
01:12:49.000 --> 01:12:54.640
now. That is it, and
it's just nice. I like it.

826
01:12:55.680 --> 01:13:01.880
He uh complies with Hippa until he
has to reveal it's true, gess to

827
01:13:01.960 --> 01:13:08.199
reveal for everyone's safety. Oh man. That's another aspect that we talk about,

828
01:13:08.239 --> 01:13:15.000
because this episode tackles identity in a
way that feels surprisingly modern. What

829
01:13:15.239 --> 01:13:18.439
Kirk and Spock are like, why
didn't she tell us? And McCoy is

830
01:13:18.520 --> 01:13:24.720
like, because she didn't have to. She'd have to, Yeah, it's

831
01:13:24.800 --> 01:13:29.479
her choice, but you're just expecting
her to be like, I'm blind,

832
01:13:30.279 --> 01:13:34.560
you know. This is kind of
a sort of a poll. So bear

833
01:13:34.600 --> 01:13:41.039
with me here, but here we
go another sort of like another thematic connection

834
01:13:41.119 --> 01:13:48.680
between the two properties is would be
people like groups. So with her,

835
01:13:48.880 --> 01:13:53.159
you know, she is, she's
a woman, she's a doctor. She's

836
01:13:53.199 --> 01:13:59.319
clearly like she's in a marginalized position
having and being able to command power and

837
01:13:59.439 --> 01:14:03.159
agency. And then also seeing the
clones, who I guess ostensibly they have

838
01:14:03.279 --> 01:14:09.119
firepower, but they themselves you know, they're being used within a conflict,

839
01:14:09.479 --> 01:14:12.520
Like what does that agency look like? Oh, man, I see where

840
01:14:12.520 --> 01:14:16.720
you're going. Yeah, well that's
where I went. Yeah, like what

841
01:14:16.800 --> 01:14:21.760
does that power mean for them?
And to reclaim that power? That the

842
01:14:21.840 --> 01:14:28.640
perception that people have of your lack
of power or you can you only are

843
01:14:28.680 --> 01:14:31.479
what you can give to me kind
of thing I mean, is there in

844
01:14:31.520 --> 01:14:35.239
truth? No beauty? It's in
the name. The episode is obsessed with

845
01:14:35.359 --> 01:14:42.520
how hot Miranda Jones is, and
she's screaming out loud like, no,

846
01:14:42.680 --> 01:14:45.640
I am so much more. I
am hurt, I am intelligent, I

847
01:14:45.680 --> 01:14:53.199
am telepathic, I am a work
in progress, I am strong. No,

848
01:14:53.920 --> 01:15:00.079
I mean it's so well, the
clones, all being men, might

849
01:15:00.119 --> 01:15:06.119
have those aspects of themselves too,
but because they are men and also soldiers,

850
01:15:08.800 --> 01:15:13.760
Yeah, Yeah, they're very that
stuff. Those expressions come out in

851
01:15:13.800 --> 01:15:19.119
action, right exactly. Gosh,
there's an entire discourse in there too with

852
01:15:19.199 --> 01:15:23.359
Maranda Pitten, like what is beauty? Of of course, you know,

853
01:15:23.439 --> 01:15:28.359
that's what the the title is referring
to, but they like they cannot understand

854
01:15:28.439 --> 01:15:30.720
how she would want to be so
connected to something so ugly, and she's

855
01:15:30.760 --> 01:15:34.479
just like what, like, there's
so much more to this existence in this

856
01:15:34.560 --> 01:15:39.560
world, like she is, I
am more than this beauty like and a

857
01:15:39.600 --> 01:15:43.840
weaker Star Trek episode would have been
like, you're right, I need to

858
01:15:43.840 --> 01:15:46.760
be with my own kind. I've
completely pushed away the human experience because also

859
01:15:46.800 --> 01:15:49.920
Star Trek is very much human propaganda. That's one of the things that I

860
01:15:50.039 --> 01:15:56.159
like. And also this episode is
just like no, you are I mean

861
01:15:56.600 --> 01:16:01.039
you everyone else gets to see her
for who she is. It's it extremely

862
01:16:01.439 --> 01:16:04.760
That's so funny, is that,
Like, it is an extremely human episode

863
01:16:04.920 --> 01:16:09.680
to be like I'm going to make
the choice I'm going to make, like

864
01:16:09.960 --> 01:16:14.039
you know, and I really wow, this is a really good episode and

865
01:16:14.039 --> 01:16:17.760
talking about it made me like it
even more certainly, but oh, it

866
01:16:17.840 --> 01:16:21.399
was part of the concept of the
podcast. Yeah, only one can win.

867
01:16:23.239 --> 01:16:25.920
Wait before we do, just one
last thing, one last week,

868
01:16:26.319 --> 01:16:29.399
last time. I'm so sorry,
one last thing, last thing. Every

869
01:16:29.479 --> 01:16:33.319
time I get to see Spock smile, I lose my mind. It's great

870
01:16:33.960 --> 01:16:38.840
because in this he is he is
mine melding. He's melded with the with

871
01:16:38.920 --> 01:16:43.119
the Medusa, and so it's like
he's like a tubic situation and he's like

872
01:16:43.720 --> 01:16:50.880
spocks spocks and soliloquoy, soliloquy,
soliloquy, soliloquy, yes, very Shakespeare.

873
01:16:50.960 --> 01:17:00.359
Rather the melding of spocka colos that
soliloquy, this existence spokal speculus,

874
01:17:00.439 --> 01:17:09.840
spous spucklosuckles cookies, that's right,
and going this existence is lonely. You're

875
01:17:09.920 --> 01:17:15.880
so alone. Yeah, Oh my
god, it's it's a superb piece of

876
01:17:15.920 --> 01:17:23.239
dialogue that I won't dare to even
approximate. Oh my god, wow,

877
01:17:23.359 --> 01:17:26.840
these are. But really, let's
put it under the ring as we rank

878
01:17:26.920 --> 01:17:31.680
both of these episodes. Oh my
god, sorry, Aspen, you gotta

879
01:17:31.720 --> 01:17:36.119
deal with it. Wow, man, this conversation talked me into higher scores

880
01:17:36.159 --> 01:17:40.600
for both of them. You love
to see it, I love to feel

881
01:17:40.600 --> 01:17:44.439
it. Uh, Aspen, gonna
make you go first with is there in

882
01:17:44.520 --> 01:17:46.600
truth? No? Beauty. What
are you gonna rake this out? I'm

883
01:17:46.600 --> 01:17:50.079
going for like a seven point nine. Hell yeah, you love to see

884
01:17:50.119 --> 01:17:56.439
it? I do. Oh you
know what? Fuck it eight SOD eight

885
01:17:57.000 --> 01:18:00.239
aspen. Oh, I love it. You'll have to see it. I

886
01:18:00.399 --> 01:18:03.720
love this. I'm going to rank
this episode of seven. I think this

887
01:18:03.800 --> 01:18:06.720
is a great forty two minute episode, but it goes on for another nine

888
01:18:06.760 --> 01:18:12.560
minutes. Uh and I felt I
for some reason, I just really felt

889
01:18:12.560 --> 01:18:21.000
that pacing in the end because you're
a that's true? Yes from Mark Cushman

890
01:18:21.039 --> 01:18:27.439
and what's her what's her name?
Also help with the book, Belinda Belinda

891
01:18:27.680 --> 01:18:35.079
mes Goood. Yeah, as yeah, it's still anyone's game. As we

892
01:18:35.199 --> 01:18:41.880
go to rookies from Star Wars the
Clone Wars, I'm gonna give it an

893
01:18:41.920 --> 01:18:49.239
eight as well. Yeah. Oh
boy, it's all down to me,

894
01:18:49.279 --> 01:18:54.640
isn't it. This could throw the
game, This could throw the whole thing.

895
01:18:56.359 --> 01:19:00.000
You've got so much power. I'm
gonna it a six point nine.

896
01:19:00.760 --> 01:19:05.239
What just because I liked? Is
there in truth? No beauty just a

897
01:19:05.279 --> 01:19:16.640
little bit more? Okay? Well
but also nice? Is that fair?

898
01:19:16.720 --> 01:19:23.800
Though? Answer is who cares?
There's no such thing as objective ranking in

899
01:19:24.039 --> 01:19:29.640
art because It's all completely situational.
And the situation right now is that because

900
01:19:29.640 --> 01:19:38.560
of me Stortrik, when's the wee
lie? That's okay. I should have

901
01:19:38.600 --> 01:19:42.279
tried to make the math harder for
you. That's absolutely true. I didn't

902
01:19:42.399 --> 01:19:49.479
even mention that the cinematography is there. No beauty goes off the chain.

903
01:19:49.960 --> 01:19:58.920
It is unhinged. We are talking
deep purples, deep greens. They discovered

904
01:19:58.920 --> 01:20:02.680
the wide angle lens this week and
so much as wide angle lens and it

905
01:20:03.159 --> 01:20:08.840
rips. Jerry Finnerman, the DP
on this on Star Trek, just went

906
01:20:09.199 --> 01:20:14.000
off this week and to that I
gave you a track Wars Honorary Badge of

907
01:20:14.039 --> 01:20:20.760
Courage. There's a shot. I
gotta write that down. There's a shot

908
01:20:23.000 --> 01:20:30.399
from like looking onto the bridge from
like the entryway, and it occurred to

909
01:20:30.439 --> 01:20:32.720
me that that had never happened before. Yeah, like you don't know what

910
01:20:32.760 --> 01:20:39.000
the perspective is walking onto the bridge. They wild they had done a handheld

911
01:20:39.039 --> 01:20:43.840
shot in the Corbamite maneuver, but
they have never just done a wide angle

912
01:20:43.840 --> 01:20:48.359
shot that also shows the ceiling.
Yes, new, but there are still

913
01:20:48.760 --> 01:20:53.319
new things to discover by the Enterprise
also as canon. Now that we can

914
01:20:53.359 --> 01:20:56.840
give honorary badges a courage. So
okay, keep that in mind. I

915
01:20:56.840 --> 01:21:02.439
give Jerry Fennerman the inaugurative, the
inaugura, rare Inauguralal, No, you're

916
01:21:02.520 --> 01:21:09.640
doing great. You know what it
is as what it is. I don't

917
01:21:09.640 --> 01:21:13.760
want to say this. Yeah,
yeah, I went on I went on

918
01:21:13.760 --> 01:21:18.800
a day swim. Oh, and
I think it's just completely through me because

919
01:21:18.840 --> 01:21:21.279
I was just drinking the pool water
the entire time. I was like,

920
01:21:21.359 --> 01:21:27.840
blop blop, clop clopp. That's
what I'll do, you man, not

921
01:21:28.000 --> 01:21:33.119
nearly as much as the night swim, which you know, but I have

922
01:21:33.119 --> 01:21:36.920
to call out that I am so
bad at sitting in chairs and I can

923
01:21:36.960 --> 01:21:42.159
never feel comfortable. And I just
pulled my leg up and accidentally revealed a

924
01:21:42.279 --> 01:21:46.079
touch of my foot on screen.
Forgetting entirely that we are now trying to

925
01:21:46.079 --> 01:21:54.319
do more video format and I'm terrified. I was like, no, wait,

926
01:21:54.479 --> 01:22:00.199
sorry, And that's because of my
night swim. We didn't even talk

927
01:22:00.199 --> 01:22:02.800
about the fact that Larry Marvick died
exactly like padme. He died of just

928
01:22:03.119 --> 01:22:08.359
he just gave up. Oh I
thought that. I like that. Yeah,

929
01:22:08.439 --> 01:22:10.520
yeah, he just gave up.
He just gave up. Of a

930
01:22:10.520 --> 01:22:14.720
broken heart, of a broken heart, but badness and madness, and you

931
01:22:14.760 --> 01:22:18.640
know who drives us mad our patrons, we love so much. We love

932
01:22:18.640 --> 01:22:21.920
you so much. Why won't you
date us? Why won't you date us?

933
01:22:24.399 --> 01:22:32.560
We're all eligible, we are so
single, We're not no, we're

934
01:22:32.720 --> 01:22:39.159
extremely taken. Uh aspen We we
love our patrons. And at five dollars

935
01:22:39.199 --> 01:22:43.800
a month, you can get extra
content every single week, including extended versions

936
01:22:43.800 --> 01:22:48.079
of these episodes and uh or whenever
we're good about early versions of these episodes.

937
01:22:48.159 --> 01:22:54.800
This week we talked about Furiosa,
Got Challengers, the Alcolyte Yes,

938
01:22:55.119 --> 01:23:00.239
Doctor Who, and more. So
you can sign up for five dollars month

939
01:23:00.279 --> 01:23:04.560
and joined the fine auspices of fine
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940
01:23:04.600 --> 01:23:09.279
Love, Heidi Rogers, Kevin Millier, Arizona, Mark Austin Aaron and

941
01:23:09.399 --> 01:23:14.000
lastly, but certainly not leastly,
Joel t Partner, who also happened to

942
01:23:14.079 --> 01:23:18.760
compose the I starship At theme song. Our main theme song is credited to

943
01:23:18.920 --> 01:23:24.279
mister tosin Awrofesso. Where you can
see more hot licks that he makes down

944
01:23:24.279 --> 01:23:28.560
in the show notes below. Click
on that and give him some business folks,

945
01:23:28.600 --> 01:23:31.520
Thank you so much for listening.
Asking anything else before we take it

946
01:23:31.560 --> 01:23:35.920
out, No, I just love
you and give you a little giezes on

947
01:23:35.960 --> 01:23:41.439
your chlorine head, Aspen. I
love you so much. I love talking

948
01:23:41.479 --> 01:23:45.399
with you every single week. Listeners, we love you, Live long,

949
01:23:45.439 --> 01:23:47.000
and prosper that may the Force be
with you.